WEBVTT

1
00:00:02.573 --> 00:00:03.473
and Stolz gets forward,

2
00:00:03.474 --> 00:00:05.133
he's got Heskey on for the pass,

3
00:00:05.293 --> 00:00:05.713
England are in again,

4
00:00:05.714 --> 00:00:07.134
it's Emil Heskey

5
00:00:14.936 --> 00:00:21.886
It's five Welcome to today's podcast where we're joined by legend Emil Heskey,

6
00:00:21.887 --> 00:00:23.486
it's an absolute pleasure to have you Emil Thank you,

7
00:00:23.487 --> 00:00:26.287
thank you for having me And Greg as well,

8
00:00:26.567 --> 00:00:26.927
thank you,

9
00:00:27.607 --> 00:00:29.848
Greg sorted all this out so gotta give him

10
00:00:30.088 --> 00:00:36.910
a shout out as well but Emil obviously we were just talking about youth football there and

11
00:00:37.894 --> 00:00:43.072
I want to just start with that because obviously you've got a couple of kids who are playing

12
00:00:45.316 --> 00:00:47.177
Man City are they both still at Man City?

13
00:00:47.197 --> 00:00:53.615
No the ones the eldest ones on loan at Sheffield Wednesday and the younger ones now playing for Cologne in

14
00:00:53.995 --> 00:00:59.388
Germany Nice and was that because we were obviously talking there about progression you

15
00:00:59.576 --> 00:01:16.152
progression was that something you had an influence on as well yeah I think more down to the agent and then obviously the player himself my son wants to play football yeah and at some stage you've got to break in he's now going to be 19 soon the younger one so

16
00:01:16.153 --> 00:01:27.488
he needs to actually play regularly he doesn't want to be left out left behind and you've got players now who are 18 19 they've got 100 games under their belt yeah and you're there as a

17
00:01:27.628 --> 00:01:37.687
and there's an emerging talent and in the top ranking of this and the top ranking of that and you've got two yeah at some stage he's got a match up so and then the elder one he was on loan at

18
00:01:38.327 --> 00:01:56.972
Sheffield Wednesday last season absolutely loved it fans were great tough season for them anyway but now went back and hopefully can try and push for promotion this year yeah that's I would agree like what we were talking about earlier just getting getting those guys first team games is always important

19
00:01:57.452 --> 00:01:58.412
But I want to start,

20
00:01:58.552 --> 00:01:58.853
obviously,

21
00:01:59.073 --> 00:02:02.454
with your career and where it all started.

22
00:02:04.574 --> 00:02:04.894
Leicester?

23
00:02:05.174 --> 00:02:05.334
Yes.

24
00:02:06.275 --> 00:02:08.035
Who was the manager at Leicester at that point?

25
00:02:08.075 --> 00:02:08.635
Was it Mark or Neil?

26
00:02:08.636 --> 00:02:09.476
Mark McGee.

27
00:02:09.477 --> 00:02:10.216
Mark McGee,

28
00:02:10.496 --> 00:02:10.716
jeez.

29
00:02:10.717 --> 00:02:12.557
So when I made my debut,

30
00:02:12.558 --> 00:02:13.733
it was Mark McGee.

31
00:02:14.013 --> 00:02:14.893
Brian Little was there.

32
00:02:15.294 --> 00:02:17.094
I'd done a little bit of training with them then,

33
00:02:17.274 --> 00:02:19.175
because when I left school at 16,

34
00:02:19.415 --> 00:02:20.715
you joined YTS.

35
00:02:23.756 --> 00:02:25.317
did a little bit of training with the first team then,

36
00:02:25.378 --> 00:02:26.699
but then he left for Villa,

37
00:02:26.739 --> 00:02:27.159
I think it was,

38
00:02:27.160 --> 00:02:28.000
and then Mark McGee came in.

39
00:02:28.320 --> 00:02:28.440
Yeah.

40
00:02:29.100 --> 00:02:29.521
Mark McGee,

41
00:02:29.541 --> 00:02:30.602
what was he like to work under?

42
00:02:30.682 --> 00:02:30.982
Really good.

43
00:02:31.382 --> 00:02:31.983
Really good.

44
00:02:32.583 --> 00:02:32.904
Forward.

45
00:02:33.344 --> 00:02:36.066
So everything was geared to us looking good.

46
00:02:36.935 --> 00:02:37.235
You know,

47
00:02:37.375 --> 00:02:39.978
we did all our sessions just like forward sessions,

48
00:02:39.998 --> 00:02:41.659
so really good.

49
00:02:41.839 --> 00:02:41.979
But

50
00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:43.701
I played

51
00:02:44.401 --> 00:02:45.422
18s football for the first,

52
00:02:45.482 --> 00:02:45.742
say,

53
00:02:47.551 --> 00:02:53.336
six months or something like that from when I left school at 16 and then joined with them.

54
00:02:53.712 --> 00:02:53.912
Yeah.

55
00:02:53.913 --> 00:02:55.176
Um,

56
00:02:55.777 --> 00:02:56.917
and who,

57
00:02:57.037 --> 00:02:58.537
what was Neil Lennon and stuff at that?

58
00:02:58.597 --> 00:03:00.178
The club came later with,

59
00:03:00.338 --> 00:03:00.518
with,

60
00:03:00.998 --> 00:03:01.178
um,

61
00:03:02.779 --> 00:03:03.179
Martin and Neil.

62
00:03:03.499 --> 00:03:03.699
Yeah.

63
00:03:04.059 --> 00:03:08.052
So let me try and think who was there at the time.

64
00:03:09.372 --> 00:03:10.013
David Lowe.

65
00:03:10.014 --> 00:03:11.549
Um,

66
00:03:11.669 --> 00:03:12.609
I'm not even sure.

67
00:03:12.949 --> 00:03:13.650
Ewan Roberts was,

68
00:03:13.830 --> 00:03:15.370
I think Ewan might've been there already.

69
00:03:16.470 --> 00:03:17.030
Colin Hill.

70
00:03:17.939 --> 00:03:18.919
Matty Elliott there as well.

71
00:03:18.920 --> 00:03:19.039
No,

72
00:03:19.159 --> 00:03:19.699
they come later.

73
00:03:19.700 --> 00:03:20.659
Is that after as well?

74
00:03:20.660 --> 00:03:20.779
Yeah,

75
00:03:20.780 --> 00:03:21.120
they come later.

76
00:03:21.121 --> 00:03:21.720
Jesus Christ.

77
00:03:22.408 --> 00:03:39.777
and big matt yell it was a yeah he's a beast proper beast yeah we had we had a strong strong backbone we did we had him spencer prior uh steve walsh uh joe taggart we had some beasts yeah and were you from leicester born and raised in leicester yeah came

78
00:03:39.797 --> 00:03:48.916
through the ranks and i started there at nine so it was like a center of excellence so you train on tuesday and thursday nights there's 50 kids running around and then

79
00:03:49.380 --> 00:03:50.021
Throughout the years,

80
00:03:50.022 --> 00:03:51.742
they whittle it down till you get to your 16s.

81
00:03:53.331 --> 00:03:57.215
And then that's the key moment of whether you're going to go into what was a YTS,

82
00:03:57.275 --> 00:03:57.675
which was,

83
00:03:58.215 --> 00:03:58.756
you know,

84
00:04:00.533 --> 00:04:01.874
it was a youth training.

85
00:04:02.074 --> 00:04:02.234
Yeah.

86
00:04:02.334 --> 00:04:03.515
So it was a government thing then.

87
00:04:03.924 --> 00:04:10.937
So you get £35 the first year and £42 something,

88
00:04:11.037 --> 00:04:12.759
£42.50 or something like that the second year.

89
00:04:13.479 --> 00:04:18.876
So I was playing my first year of football on £42.

90
00:04:19.568 --> 00:04:35.812
50 Jesus Christ 100 it's weird because I got that like when I left school I was they said what do you want to be and I'm like a mechanic I just wanted a car a mechanic and I got 40 quid skill secret it was called yeah you get that so

91
00:04:35.872 --> 00:04:47.396
it's kind of like it's like work experience isn't it yeah so it was so yeah first year was 35 it's interesting so I've just come off a tour with some of the lads and some of them are older and theirs was you

92
00:04:48.128 --> 00:04:49.651
Their second year was 35.

93
00:04:50.012 --> 00:04:52.176
The first year was 27 something.

94
00:04:52.868 --> 00:04:55.393
So then our first year was 35.

95
00:04:55.394 --> 00:04:56.014
Yeah.

96
00:04:56.074 --> 00:04:57.637
Next year was 42 something.

97
00:04:57.677 --> 00:04:59.160
Then the next one was 45.

98
00:05:00.027 --> 00:05:02.568
And did you ever like see if you were getting a sniff of the first team or anything?

99
00:05:02.608 --> 00:05:04.070
Did it go up or were you still on that?

100
00:05:04.070 --> 00:05:04.109
No,

101
00:05:04.111 --> 00:05:04.229
no,

102
00:05:04.250 --> 00:05:05.630
you were on that because that's my contract.

103
00:05:06.255 --> 00:05:07.454
And then I wasn't allowed to sign,

104
00:05:07.494 --> 00:05:08.935
because I got in at 17.

105
00:05:09.479 --> 00:05:11.781
So you weren't allowed to sign a pro contract until you were 18.

106
00:05:12.436 --> 00:05:14.157
That played my first full season,

107
00:05:14.538 --> 00:05:14.697
well,

108
00:05:15.173 --> 00:05:16.854
half a season on 40 to something.

109
00:05:18.427 --> 00:05:19.567
Value for money back then,

110
00:05:19.569 --> 00:05:19.688
eh?

111
00:05:21.948 --> 00:05:26.150
And when you came into the team at that age,

112
00:05:26.510 --> 00:05:28.892
was there any particular senior guy that took you under the...

113
00:05:29.899 --> 00:05:30.861
We had so many good ones.

114
00:05:30.901 --> 00:05:31.940
Walshie was the main one.

115
00:05:32.180 --> 00:05:33.762
Steve Walsh was our captain.

116
00:05:33.882 --> 00:05:34.642
He'd been there,

117
00:05:34.762 --> 00:05:35.062
Jesus,

118
00:05:35.122 --> 00:05:36.902
I was a kid when I was watching Walshie play.

119
00:05:37.223 --> 00:05:37.762
Do you know what I mean?

120
00:05:37.822 --> 00:05:39.163
So he'd been there for a long time.

121
00:05:39.164 --> 00:05:39.824
He was our captain,

122
00:05:39.844 --> 00:05:40.503
our talisman.

123
00:05:40.865 --> 00:05:43.685
He was the one that really looked after all the young lads.

124
00:05:44.085 --> 00:05:46.767
I still stayed in the youth changing rooms.

125
00:05:46.986 --> 00:05:48.928
I didn't really want to go into the changing rooms.

126
00:05:49.368 --> 00:05:54.570
You go from cleaning everyone's boots and then knocking on the door and have to wait for someone to come in.

127
00:05:55.109 --> 00:05:55.850
Then going in there,

128
00:05:56.210 --> 00:05:57.190
it didn't really sit well.

129
00:05:57.230 --> 00:05:59.031
So I just stayed with the youth team and that.

130
00:05:59.511 --> 00:05:59.892
But yeah,

131
00:06:00.352 --> 00:06:01.793
Walshie was the main one.

132
00:06:01.813 --> 00:06:03.075
He's the man around town.

133
00:06:03.315 --> 00:06:03.535
Yeah.

134
00:06:04.433 --> 00:06:11.195
And obviously you've done well at Leicester and want to jump over to getting the move to Liverpool.

135
00:06:11.575 --> 00:06:12.796
How did that come about?

136
00:06:15.238 --> 00:06:16.559
There's several different facets of it.

137
00:06:16.579 --> 00:06:16.700
So

138
00:06:17.440 --> 00:06:18.942
I think they'd been watching me for a while.

139
00:06:19.402 --> 00:06:22.033
There's a tournament called Keele.

140
00:06:22.034 --> 00:06:22.934
At Keele University,

141
00:06:22.935 --> 00:06:24.095
they used to have a tournament every year.

142
00:06:24.475 --> 00:06:25.176
where all the teams,

143
00:06:25.196 --> 00:06:25.776
a lot of the teams,

144
00:06:25.816 --> 00:06:26.297
Blackburn,

145
00:06:26.777 --> 00:06:27.177
Liverpool,

146
00:06:27.758 --> 00:06:28.018
all there.

147
00:06:28.058 --> 00:06:28.999
We went there as Leicester,

148
00:06:29.019 --> 00:06:29.359
obviously.

149
00:06:30.148 --> 00:06:30.648
Played there,

150
00:06:30.848 --> 00:06:32.170
and I think at 16,

151
00:06:32.710 --> 00:06:34.419
there was interest in me,

152
00:06:34.500 --> 00:06:36.142
and I'd played England in the 16s as well.

153
00:06:38.138 --> 00:06:39.099
But then I broke into

154
00:06:39.479 --> 00:06:41.382
Leicester, there was a lot of interest from Blackburn,

155
00:06:41.401 --> 00:06:41.762
et cetera.

156
00:06:41.901 --> 00:06:42.702
I broke into Leicester,

157
00:06:42.703 --> 00:06:43.082
and I was like,

158
00:06:43.183 --> 00:06:43.323
look,

159
00:06:43.344 --> 00:06:43.983
I want to play here.

160
00:06:44.404 --> 00:06:45.164
I was happy to play.

161
00:06:46.217 --> 00:06:46.577
And then

162
00:06:47.330 --> 00:06:47.990
England under

163
00:06:48.611 --> 00:06:49.313
18s tournament,

164
00:06:50.112 --> 00:06:51.454
Euros in France.

165
00:06:54.127 --> 00:06:56.445
Gerald Houllier was the manager of France under

166
00:06:56.865 --> 00:06:58.165
18s. Henri Trezeguet,

167
00:06:58.863 --> 00:06:59.262
Anelka,

168
00:07:00.482 --> 00:07:00.904
Darbol,

169
00:07:01.955 --> 00:07:02.455
Scalas,

170
00:07:04.534 --> 00:07:05.053
Silvestre,

171
00:07:07.767 --> 00:07:08.026
Cissé.

172
00:07:08.787 --> 00:07:09.607
We ended up going to

173
00:07:10.680 --> 00:07:11.481
West Ham for a little bit.

174
00:07:11.957 --> 00:07:12.938
Players like that playing.

175
00:07:13.118 --> 00:07:14.559
And it was me and Michael up front.

176
00:07:15.315 --> 00:07:17.175
And then he'd seen me there and that's when he said,

177
00:07:17.177 --> 00:07:17.375
all right,

178
00:07:17.377 --> 00:07:18.057
and when he comes,

179
00:07:18.556 --> 00:07:20.677
I'm the player that he wants to bring you.

180
00:07:20.678 --> 00:07:23.216
So I was available after that.

181
00:07:24.620 --> 00:07:25.359
Not bad at all.

182
00:07:25.440 --> 00:07:27.180
And you mentioned Michael there.

183
00:07:27.421 --> 00:07:27.661
Obviously,

184
00:07:27.662 --> 00:07:35.677
he went to Liverpool and obviously formed that partnership with Michael there.

185
00:07:36.317 --> 00:07:38.998
It's one of those partnerships that just clicks.

186
00:07:39.157 --> 00:07:39.317
Yeah.

187
00:07:39.438 --> 00:07:40.238
It just works.

188
00:07:40.878 --> 00:07:42.500
I can't explain why it works.

189
00:07:42.500 --> 00:07:43.219
It just works.

190
00:07:43.900 --> 00:07:44.921
Under-18s England,

191
00:07:45.061 --> 00:07:45.781
me and him together,

192
00:07:46.341 --> 00:07:47.762
everything just ticked really well.

193
00:07:50.147 --> 00:07:52.008
Some of the stuff that I'm not so good at,

194
00:07:52.028 --> 00:07:52.608
he's brilliant at.

195
00:07:53.348 --> 00:08:05.415
he's not so good at it and brilliant at it and it just it just worked so well worked well together from then under 18 Michael's two years younger than me so he's playing with my age group there then we went to the

196
00:08:05.815 --> 00:08:12.386
21s I think Michael played one game at the 21s then went and jumped up into the first team and then it was just a progression really and

197
00:08:13.738 --> 00:08:21.999
Michael as a as a player obviously done really really well but would you say he was one of the the best partners you ever had?

198
00:08:23.219 --> 00:08:42.794
favourite partner yeah just worked really well everything understanding he's a brilliant player though yeah he's a great player so it helps you as well he takes a little bit of the burden off you as well who made who look good is the question he was he was outstanding and the thing is I don't think he gets the recognition that he should do from the

199
00:08:42.835 --> 00:08:50.480
brilliance that he is yeah because I think a lot of people just see him as this kind of old injury prone guy like obviously in a lot of parts of his career when I'm like

200
00:08:51.168 --> 00:08:51.288
No,

201
00:08:52.208 --> 00:08:53.448
Just carries games.

202
00:08:53.769 --> 00:08:54.750
The thing is with Michael,

203
00:08:55.010 --> 00:08:55.750
and people don't really,

204
00:08:55.751 --> 00:08:57.312
and I don't think he's even mentioned it,

205
00:08:57.591 --> 00:08:59.872
Michael would be wheeled out injured for us.

206
00:09:00.192 --> 00:09:00.372
Yeah.

207
00:09:00.392 --> 00:09:01.393
Go and score and then come off.

208
00:09:02.674 --> 00:09:02.994
Yeah,

209
00:09:03.014 --> 00:09:04.975
it's true.

210
00:09:05.075 --> 00:09:05.395
Yeah.

211
00:09:05.455 --> 00:09:05.836
Then you look,

212
00:09:05.916 --> 00:09:12.651
and we're all sitting here as ex-players and we creak when we get up and you can imagine how he's feeling now where he's put his body,

213
00:09:12.811 --> 00:09:15.526
what he's had to put his body through week in,

214
00:09:15.546 --> 00:09:17.667
week out to try and get results for a team that he loves.

215
00:09:18.207 --> 00:09:18.767
And

216
00:09:19.155 --> 00:09:20.456
Obviously prior to going to Liverpool,

217
00:09:20.457 --> 00:09:21.996
was there other teams sniffing around as well?

218
00:09:22.077 --> 00:09:22.916
There was quite a few.

219
00:09:23.136 --> 00:09:23.916
I had Roma,

220
00:09:24.097 --> 00:09:24.558
Dortmund,

221
00:09:25.678 --> 00:09:25.918
Villa,

222
00:09:26.577 --> 00:09:27.077
Spurs,

223
00:09:28.346 --> 00:09:30.186
Chelsea.

224
00:09:30.346 --> 00:09:32.327
Not a bad amount.

225
00:09:32.347 --> 00:09:35.324
I think it was a perfect move for him and for Liverpool.

226
00:09:35.744 --> 00:09:37.064
I think it was a...

227
00:09:38.557 --> 00:09:40.697
So when I came through Leicester,

228
00:09:42.237 --> 00:09:45.498
the five years I played at Leicester I went to Wembley four times.

229
00:09:46.403 --> 00:09:48.143
Playoff final and three League Cup finals.

230
00:09:49.080 --> 00:09:50.602
So the next stage for me was,

231
00:09:50.803 --> 00:09:51.043
okay,

232
00:09:51.124 --> 00:09:52.465
I'm at a club that I'm,

233
00:09:52.745 --> 00:09:53.246
I'm raised.

234
00:09:53.267 --> 00:09:54.885
I can do more or less what I want.

235
00:09:55.125 --> 00:09:55.305
Yeah.

236
00:09:55.526 --> 00:09:56.527
Um,

237
00:09:56.827 --> 00:09:58.908
I need to figure out what is next.

238
00:09:59.637 --> 00:10:12.458
for me here or do I don't take that next step where I'm challenging for league titles I'm challenging for other other clubs Champions League football all this sort of all this sort of playing against the elite so the next step was that for me and I was what

239
00:10:12.858 --> 00:10:28.009
22 it's interesting because everyone thought that I was like 26 27 when I joined I was 22 just turned 22 when I had when I'd left Leicester to go and join Liverpool still a young lad but I the next step for me was what did it look like

240
00:10:28.881 --> 00:10:30.482
challenging for league,

241
00:10:31.971 --> 00:10:32.291
winning

242
00:10:32.631 --> 00:10:33.072
FA Cup,

243
00:10:33.312 --> 00:10:34.833
going to the Champions League or

244
00:10:35.854 --> 00:10:36.314
UEFA Cup.

245
00:10:36.754 --> 00:10:36.934
Yeah.

246
00:10:36.954 --> 00:10:38.956
And going and challenging and winning that sort of stuff.

247
00:10:39.336 --> 00:10:40.157
What does it look like?

248
00:10:40.197 --> 00:10:40.697
How is it?

249
00:10:40.857 --> 00:10:41.538
What sort of football?

250
00:10:41.598 --> 00:10:42.138
What's the tempo?

251
00:10:43.451 --> 00:10:45.232
Playing every three to four days.

252
00:10:45.252 --> 00:10:48.835
There was one year where we played and I kid you not,

253
00:10:48.836 --> 00:10:50.396
we played something like Sunday,

254
00:10:50.872 --> 00:10:51.593
Tuesday,

255
00:10:52.073 --> 00:10:52.714
Friday,

256
00:10:52.794 --> 00:10:53.094
Sunday.

257
00:10:53.434 --> 00:10:55.067
Yeah.

258
00:10:55.068 --> 00:10:57.769
It was just so many games just crammed in and we talk about

259
00:10:57.829 --> 00:11:05.357
a lot of games now the season we won the treble we played 63 games 63

260
00:11:05.837 --> 00:11:07.858
63 65 65 63,

261
00:11:07.938 --> 00:11:27.553
65 games I played 59 games oh man which is the travelling yeah and the travelling is the worst to be fair you're going flying here and trying to come back and then you're not really sleeping well and then you're trying to take a sleeping tablet to make sure you get a good sleep and then you don't get your food that you want and stuff like that it's not easy and what was the you

262
00:11:27.857 --> 00:11:28.777
If you were advising,

263
00:11:28.958 --> 00:11:29.278
obviously,

264
00:11:29.279 --> 00:11:29.718
a young guy,

265
00:11:29.778 --> 00:11:34.244
what's the difference of playing for a Leicester where you were the main man to go into a club like Liverpool?

266
00:11:34.245 --> 00:11:34.424
You know,

267
00:11:34.425 --> 00:11:34.804
it's learning.

268
00:11:34.844 --> 00:11:35.644
It's all about learning.

269
00:11:36.236 --> 00:11:37.917
I was lucky because I played with a national team.

270
00:11:38.197 --> 00:11:41.398
So I'd come through Leicester's ranks where it's about fighting,

271
00:11:41.399 --> 00:11:41.959
it's about battling.

272
00:11:41.960 --> 00:11:42.859
You've got to chase that person.

273
00:11:42.959 --> 00:11:44.940
You've got to tackle there.

274
00:11:44.941 --> 00:11:45.520
You've got to run back.

275
00:11:45.560 --> 00:11:47.081
You've got to try and win ahead of there.

276
00:11:47.845 --> 00:11:52.495
That bodes you well when you go into a bigger team because you've got that fight about you,

277
00:11:52.515 --> 00:11:54.696
but then you've got to learn how to control the ball.

278
00:11:55.236 --> 00:11:56.817
You've got to learn how to pass it there.

279
00:11:57.057 --> 00:11:58.278
But I'd been with the national team.

280
00:11:58.558 --> 00:11:58.719
Yeah.

281
00:11:58.720 --> 00:12:00.260
So I learned that with the national team as well.

282
00:12:00.560 --> 00:12:00.740
Yeah.

283
00:12:00.900 --> 00:12:02.141
You can't be giving away the ball.

284
00:12:03.242 --> 00:12:03.803
You can't.

285
00:12:04.183 --> 00:12:04.503
You can't.

286
00:12:04.543 --> 00:12:05.624
You've got to hold up that ball.

287
00:12:06.185 --> 00:12:09.375
You've got to understand what runs to make,

288
00:12:09.395 --> 00:12:10.156
when to make the runs,

289
00:12:10.196 --> 00:12:10.877
when to hold it up,

290
00:12:10.897 --> 00:12:12.078
when to look in behind.

291
00:12:13.075 --> 00:12:13.595
All this stuff,

292
00:12:13.915 --> 00:12:15.537
you actually learn on the job.

293
00:12:15.857 --> 00:12:16.017
Yeah.

294
00:12:16.018 --> 00:12:16.878
You learn a lot on the job.

295
00:12:17.578 --> 00:12:18.299
That's it.

296
00:12:18.559 --> 00:12:20.781
And were you at Liverpool when Emil joined?

297
00:12:21.161 --> 00:12:22.062
One of my best mates.

298
00:12:22.382 --> 00:12:23.163
Yeah.

299
00:12:23.164 --> 00:12:25.285
It's funny because the first time when I came in,

300
00:12:25.265 --> 00:12:41.635
the old training ground I mean the old oh yeah yeah Melwood old Melwood we had a small gym you know and I used to go because Gerard he said to me oh you have to go to gym you need to be stronger and every time he mean was there you remember it's only him and me yeah

301
00:12:42.015 --> 00:12:52.301
when you look at them old gyms it's just like one little round thing you know with the different stations and you're trying to push weights off that and you're looking at how big Liverpool is you're thinking what is this

302
00:12:52.829 --> 00:12:54.710
Then obviously we moved to the new Melwood.

303
00:12:55.290 --> 00:12:56.430
New building was the key.

304
00:12:56.450 --> 00:12:56.830
Yeah.

305
00:12:56.831 --> 00:12:57.310
Absolutely.

306
00:12:57.311 --> 00:12:58.411
It needed to be that.

307
00:12:58.412 --> 00:13:00.191
It was the key to reach the success.

308
00:13:01.539 --> 00:13:03.860
But you're talking about the partnership with Michael.

309
00:13:03.861 --> 00:13:04.120
I mean,

310
00:13:05.096 --> 00:13:05.777
as a defender,

311
00:13:06.293 --> 00:13:07.073
you're facing the game.

312
00:13:07.949 --> 00:13:13.011
And for the fact we knew we would score goals with the lads because one was stronger,

313
00:13:13.967 --> 00:13:14.287
strong,

314
00:13:14.507 --> 00:13:15.047
hold the ball,

315
00:13:15.048 --> 00:13:15.307
you know,

316
00:13:15.859 --> 00:13:16.720
can destroy defender.

317
00:13:16.740 --> 00:13:17.740
The other one was smart,

318
00:13:18.400 --> 00:13:18.700
sharp.

319
00:13:19.040 --> 00:13:19.260
Yeah.

320
00:13:20.073 --> 00:13:20.193
So,

321
00:13:20.194 --> 00:13:20.393
I mean,

322
00:13:20.394 --> 00:13:21.233
it was unbelievable.

323
00:13:22.798 --> 00:13:23.818
I think one thing as well,

324
00:13:23.878 --> 00:13:29.597
what we're losing a little bit within football now is the ability to use your body to hold the ball up.

325
00:13:30.077 --> 00:13:33.459
And what it means when you're holding the ball up for you.

326
00:13:33.920 --> 00:13:34.620
The gimme time.

327
00:13:34.720 --> 00:13:34.920
Yeah.

328
00:13:35.840 --> 00:13:38.402
If you keep playing the ball up to me and it keeps coming back,

329
00:13:38.662 --> 00:13:39.663
at some stage he's going to say,

330
00:13:39.664 --> 00:13:42.284
I'm not playing the ball to me no more.

331
00:13:42.644 --> 00:13:48.127
And then your whole vision of what the game looks like looks totally different.

332
00:13:48.387 --> 00:13:48.607
Yeah.

333
00:13:48.968 --> 00:13:51.089
So now we're losing that.

334
00:13:51.429 --> 00:13:54.430
Because we're usually playing with one up front and they don't really get involved now.

335
00:13:54.791 --> 00:13:55.551
We're playing with two.

336
00:13:55.591 --> 00:13:56.411
You have to work.

337
00:13:56.639 --> 00:13:57.380
You have to get across.

338
00:13:57.381 --> 00:13:58.480
You have to hold the ball up.

339
00:13:58.481 --> 00:13:59.240
You have to win a foul.

340
00:13:59.721 --> 00:14:01.561
Even winning a foul is brilliant because you can just...

341
00:14:01.602 --> 00:14:03.442
You know who did that over the weekend?

342
00:14:03.722 --> 00:14:04.203
Sunderland.

343
00:14:04.891 --> 00:14:05.011
Yeah.

344
00:14:05.251 --> 00:14:10.497
They were losing 1-0 and Regis Lovie went two up front and they scored.

345
00:14:10.717 --> 00:14:11.797
This is where they had the penalty.

346
00:14:12.602 --> 00:14:12.762
Yeah.

347
00:14:12.802 --> 00:14:13.642
And of course,

348
00:14:13.643 --> 00:14:15.063
it's more difficult for the defenders,

349
00:14:15.064 --> 00:14:15.263
you know?

350
00:14:15.903 --> 00:14:16.543
And as a striker,

351
00:14:16.544 --> 00:14:17.484
you have to work hard a bit.

352
00:14:17.940 --> 00:14:19.641
Yeah.

353
00:14:19.642 --> 00:14:20.161
I think Gerard,

354
00:14:20.181 --> 00:14:20.561
we are...

355
00:14:20.681 --> 00:14:41.078
I thought I had this in mind yeah to play you and Michael at front yeah but as well with that we changed it a little bit where defensive side one has to drop in so you make it a three in the midfield yeah and just leave the one up front just to shadow and now we changed it they do one up front but when they defend they go with two up front so

356
00:14:41.298 --> 00:14:50.057
yeah easier life but what what was who were you like as a manager for you I thought he was brilliant I thought tactically he was really really good you

357
00:14:51.233 --> 00:14:52.157
understanding the game.

358
00:14:52.217 --> 00:14:52.780
I'd gone from

359
00:14:54.560 --> 00:14:55.400
I don't know what it was like for you,

360
00:14:55.440 --> 00:14:58.161
but I'd gone from being at Leicester where we didn't really do much tactics.

361
00:14:58.162 --> 00:15:00.502
We had some really good players and it was about unity,

362
00:15:01.342 --> 00:15:01.622
fight,

363
00:15:01.742 --> 00:15:01.962
fight,

364
00:15:02.022 --> 00:15:02.262
fight,

365
00:15:02.422 --> 00:15:02.702
unity.

366
00:15:03.123 --> 00:15:03.843
Give the ball to Emil,

367
00:15:03.844 --> 00:15:04.663
he can run with the ball.

368
00:15:05.103 --> 00:15:05.603
Give it to Muzzi,

369
00:15:05.604 --> 00:15:06.143
he can chew a ball.

370
00:15:06.484 --> 00:15:06.964
Give it to Lenny,

371
00:15:06.984 --> 00:15:08.184
he can find that pass.

372
00:15:08.244 --> 00:15:08.764
Give it to Gopsy,

373
00:15:08.765 --> 00:15:09.484
he can cross the ball.

374
00:15:09.881 --> 00:15:10.641
That was what it was.

375
00:15:11.161 --> 00:15:13.762
So now learning about your position,

376
00:15:14.430 --> 00:15:15.610
learning about how we want to play.

377
00:15:16.050 --> 00:15:17.571
Don't give the ball away in these areas.

378
00:15:18.519 --> 00:15:19.579
Take risks in that area.

379
00:15:19.659 --> 00:15:21.060
I was taking risks everywhere.

380
00:15:21.420 --> 00:15:21.620
Yeah.

381
00:15:22.608 --> 00:15:25.010
But you learn a lot more and you sit there.

382
00:15:25.311 --> 00:15:26.512
When I first got to Liverpool,

383
00:15:26.513 --> 00:15:27.172
it was tough.

384
00:15:27.609 --> 00:15:30.094
I'd gone from no meeting,

385
00:15:30.134 --> 00:15:30.895
no team meetings,

386
00:15:31.439 --> 00:15:32.060
to sitting there,

387
00:15:32.500 --> 00:15:33.041
dark room,

388
00:15:33.481 --> 00:15:34.322
with this big screen,

389
00:15:34.762 --> 00:15:35.523
45 minutes,

390
00:15:36.004 --> 00:15:36.404
going like this.

391
00:15:39.092 --> 00:15:40.754
You were talking about that earlier as well.

392
00:15:40.755 --> 00:15:42.095
But then you slowly,

393
00:15:42.155 --> 00:15:43.236
with the information coming in,

394
00:15:43.256 --> 00:15:43.897
you're slowly like,

395
00:15:43.937 --> 00:15:44.157
okay,

396
00:15:44.158 --> 00:15:44.277
yeah,

397
00:15:44.337 --> 00:15:45.178
what's next?

398
00:15:45.658 --> 00:15:46.679
We'd go to a point where

399
00:15:47.760 --> 00:15:49.742
I came through the youth team with Stuart Campbell.

400
00:15:50.042 --> 00:15:51.784
He was at Grimsby at the time and I'm watching.

401
00:15:52.632 --> 00:15:53.673
Us play Grimsby and I'm thinking,

402
00:15:53.753 --> 00:15:54.773
why are we going through,

403
00:15:54.774 --> 00:15:55.814
we're going through the substitutes.

404
00:15:56.575 --> 00:15:57.095
Yep.

405
00:15:57.096 --> 00:15:57.555
I'm like,

406
00:15:57.615 --> 00:15:59.256
I don't need to know anything about Grimsby.

407
00:15:59.436 --> 00:16:00.057
Just give me the ball,

408
00:16:00.058 --> 00:16:00.557
let me run it.

409
00:16:01.257 --> 00:16:03.139
But this is the mentality you need to,

410
00:16:03.140 --> 00:16:03.899
you need information.

411
00:16:04.079 --> 00:16:05.400
Yeah.

412
00:16:05.401 --> 00:16:06.460
That said,

413
00:16:06.461 --> 00:16:08.141
we had a good conversation about that coming down,

414
00:16:08.181 --> 00:16:09.642
just the amount of data and everything.

415
00:16:10.102 --> 00:16:13.741
It's a little bit too much now because again,

416
00:16:13.821 --> 00:16:18.347
you overload someone's brain with stuff and you take away the,

417
00:16:19.228 --> 00:16:19.448
this.

418
00:16:19.708 --> 00:16:41.741
spontaneity of just getting on the ball sometimes and doing something yeah you're telling them where to pass you're telling them what to do no what happened to just go and dribble in the ball putting your putting your body in the way of of you and uh of you and the player and then just going and dribbling yeah using your assets to your advantage we're losing that a little bit i think it will come back around obviously but we're losing that a little bit yeah no we

419
00:16:41.761 --> 00:16:46.864
were talking about ai and tori bloom and you could like literally go emil hesky's last

420
00:16:47.408 --> 00:16:54.643
200 games this is what he does that's what he does wrong and all that but like you say what happens to well I'll give you an example of that right so

421
00:16:57.052 --> 00:17:15.435
Arsenal we play Arsenal at home what was it I got tackled went down the physio came on you know physio comes on you have to go on the side went on the side the ball the refs call me back on I come back on the ball comes straight to me

422
00:17:15.855 --> 00:17:16.836
I dribble the ball I'm going.

423
00:17:17.417 --> 00:17:33.105
take it on my left and score and what I noticed was they kept on showing me on my left but I'm fine with using my left it's not a problem they told they told them to show me on my left yeah but then I'd done that and scored yeah so

424
00:17:34.326 --> 00:17:37.709
yeah there's only certain guys you can maybe say that to maybe like me

425
00:17:38.069 --> 00:17:40.912
I can't my left leg's only for standing on but the thing is

426
00:17:41.272 --> 00:18:03.757
we all learn how to use it the more and more and I was I'd already I'd played left wing for most of the two seasons before anyway yeah so I'd learnt to just and I was always using my left foot anyway but they told you off the data he doesn't like using his left foot you can show him down left and I'm just I'm going to swing it anyway bang use that to your advantage but

427
00:18:03.837 --> 00:18:10.000
obviously you were part of the treble winning team um good

428
00:18:10.180 --> 00:18:12.021
was that maybe your first or second season?

429
00:18:12.761 --> 00:18:13.281
First season.

430
00:18:13.301 --> 00:18:13.941
First season.

431
00:18:13.942 --> 00:18:15.182
So I joined in March.

432
00:18:15.522 --> 00:18:15.662
Yeah.

433
00:18:16.338 --> 00:18:17.978
And then that was the first full season.

434
00:18:18.722 --> 00:18:19.783
Treble winning season.

435
00:18:20.243 --> 00:18:21.123
I'm just curious.

436
00:18:22.451 --> 00:18:25.192
I always ask people this because I'm a big collector of football memorabilia.

437
00:18:25.780 --> 00:18:29.025
Do you still have all your medals?

438
00:18:29.385 --> 00:18:30.506
My dad has most of them,

439
00:18:30.507 --> 00:18:30.846
my stuff.

440
00:18:32.326 --> 00:18:36.507
There's a really nice house in the Caribbean with loads of shirts and memorabilia.

441
00:18:36.667 --> 00:18:37.568
Yeah.

442
00:18:38.188 --> 00:18:45.347
because you see the amount of guys I speak to and they're just like just gave it away to this guy and all that and you're like fuck my shirts I did

443
00:18:45.963 --> 00:18:54.467
I need boots and stuff like that yeah but I've got I've got a couple of things there's two of them my dad's got them yeah my dad's got them

444
00:18:54.915 --> 00:19:05.223
I found my one from Villa we lost it in the final but I found that one my dad's got the other ones still got my England Germany shirt

445
00:19:07.668 --> 00:19:21.418
I've got Xavi yeah so I've got a few shirts but not loads you end up giving a lot of stuff away like you're saying out of the all of the stuff you've collected over the years from other players who's the prized shirt or whatever you've got

446
00:19:22.054 --> 00:19:25.472
Rivaldo Barcelona yeah he's what a player

447
00:19:25.893 --> 00:19:28.174
I lost it as well well I say I lost it

448
00:19:28.595 --> 00:19:35.940
I'm thinking where is that shirt I'm sure I've had that shirt and I'm thinking where is it I go to the Caribbean it's on the wall in my dance I didn't even know that he took it

449
00:19:36.960 --> 00:19:41.525
Was your dad like a big football fan or was he just keeping that for you?

450
00:19:41.705 --> 00:19:42.385
He likes football,

451
00:19:42.386 --> 00:19:42.506
yeah,

452
00:19:42.507 --> 00:19:43.266
he's a big football fan,

453
00:19:43.306 --> 00:19:44.087
but he just keeps it.

454
00:19:44.107 --> 00:19:44.267
Just,

455
00:19:44.607 --> 00:19:44.788
yeah,

456
00:19:45.028 --> 00:19:45.348
keeps it.

457
00:19:45.688 --> 00:19:46.349
Yeah.

458
00:19:46.629 --> 00:19:47.410
Now the boys are playing,

459
00:19:47.411 --> 00:19:48.351
they're all over the walls now.

460
00:19:49.272 --> 00:19:50.012
And you're bombed out.

461
00:19:50.013 --> 00:19:51.394
You're just getting taken off.

462
00:19:52.174 --> 00:19:52.895
New generation.

463
00:19:52.955 --> 00:19:55.598
That's one.

464
00:19:55.958 --> 00:19:56.078
So,

465
00:19:56.639 --> 00:19:56.859
yeah,

466
00:19:56.860 --> 00:19:57.259
obviously...

467
00:20:00.526 --> 00:20:16.042
played with Mike alone and stuff obviously if you look out there people say you probably didn't score enough goals would that be an unfair criticism of you because you've done a lot of work yeah it's not even about the work you find your own niche and you work with that we won trophies yeah there

468
00:20:16.043 --> 00:20:22.044
are a lot of people with 100-200 goals and not won a thing yeah we all laud them but not won a thing yeah I'd gone from

469
00:20:23.696 --> 00:20:26.557
I went to four six league cup finals yeah

470
00:20:28.145 --> 00:20:29.906
I went to the 97 them.

471
00:20:30.826 --> 00:20:31.446
99,

472
00:20:31.526 --> 00:20:32.146
2000,

473
00:20:32.147 --> 00:20:32.967
2001,

474
00:20:34.539 --> 00:20:35.559
2003,

475
00:20:35.560 --> 00:20:39.136
and I think 2010 or 2019.

476
00:20:39.137 --> 00:20:39.496
Finals,

477
00:20:39.536 --> 00:20:40.156
League Cup finals.

478
00:20:40.376 --> 00:20:40.577
Yeah.

479
00:20:41.265 --> 00:20:42.065
So I was winning stuff.

480
00:20:42.325 --> 00:20:43.085
Yeah.

481
00:20:43.086 --> 00:20:43.545
And for me,

482
00:20:43.645 --> 00:20:44.586
that was what it was about.

483
00:20:45.366 --> 00:20:47.027
Not necessarily about all this,

484
00:20:47.667 --> 00:20:47.787
oh,

485
00:20:47.807 --> 00:20:49.167
you look at my individual accolades,

486
00:20:49.207 --> 00:20:49.327
yes,

487
00:20:49.347 --> 00:20:49.787
it's great,

488
00:20:50.196 --> 00:20:51.996
but you're a team that needs to win something.

489
00:20:52.756 --> 00:20:53.757
When I first came to

490
00:20:54.437 --> 00:20:57.398
Liverpool, I didn't realise I hadn't won anything since 95.

491
00:20:57.678 --> 00:20:57.838
Yeah.

492
00:20:58.102 --> 00:21:18.422
bad winter three cup three league cup finals in that time and people might say oh league cup it's a final yeah it's a trophy it's a trophy yeah so for me it was about winning stuff I don't really feed into I must score 20 goals and I must do this and I must do that first season was brilliant yeah but

493
00:21:18.423 --> 00:21:26.326
you learn your own niche and where you where you fit within that ecosystem yeah I know I think too many people are critical of certain players like.

494
00:21:26.366 --> 00:21:30.033
because I've got a brother-in-law that plays up the road and people,

495
00:21:30.133 --> 00:21:34.144
he's a big guy as well and he does well for the team but the fans are like,

496
00:21:34.164 --> 00:21:34.364
yeah,

497
00:21:34.485 --> 00:21:35.846
you fucking lazy bandit.

498
00:21:35.847 --> 00:21:36.486
The thing is,

499
00:21:36.526 --> 00:21:38.088
who are you trying to,

500
00:21:38.188 --> 00:21:39.389
are you looking after the manager?

501
00:21:39.629 --> 00:21:39.829
Yeah.

502
00:21:39.830 --> 00:21:41.831
Or are you looking after everyone else?

503
00:21:41.971 --> 00:21:42.191
Yeah.

504
00:21:42.711 --> 00:21:43.812
The manager tells you what to do,

505
00:21:43.872 --> 00:21:44.093
you do.

506
00:21:44.433 --> 00:21:46.795
That's why I always step back with my sons and I look at them,

507
00:21:46.835 --> 00:21:47.295
what are they doing?

508
00:21:47.296 --> 00:21:47.796
Why are they doing this?

509
00:21:48.717 --> 00:21:49.817
I don't know what he's told them.

510
00:21:51.018 --> 00:21:52.640
So I can't criticise them.

511
00:21:52.700 --> 00:21:53.380
For all I know,

512
00:21:53.821 --> 00:21:54.962
and especially the eldest one,

513
00:21:56.210 --> 00:22:16.908
when I speak to the coach they love him because he does exactly what they tell him to do and they absolutely love him and he gets played every single time and I'm thinking why don't you do this why don't you do that but I don't know what they've told him yeah so that's something you felt like even watching your kid you had to have some form of restraint yeah yeah I leave him it's not my career

514
00:22:17.248 --> 00:22:23.590
I've got to say because you see a lot of the parents at the side like if you do this and if you do that this is a mistake yeah

515
00:22:24.358 --> 00:22:25.158
Because football as well,

516
00:22:25.199 --> 00:22:26.039
especially at that level,

517
00:22:26.119 --> 00:22:26.319
right?

518
00:22:26.559 --> 00:22:26.819
Football,

519
00:22:26.859 --> 00:22:27.300
kids football,

520
00:22:27.301 --> 00:22:28.000
it's supposed to be fun.

521
00:22:28.260 --> 00:22:28.700
Yeah.

522
00:22:28.801 --> 00:22:29.601
It's supposed to be laughing.

523
00:22:29.602 --> 00:22:30.461
It's supposed to be joking.

524
00:22:30.462 --> 00:22:31.442
It's supposed to be trying stuff.

525
00:22:32.142 --> 00:22:33.407
Not looking over,

526
00:22:33.607 --> 00:22:37.589
looking over and worried that he's not happy with you or something.

527
00:22:37.590 --> 00:22:38.934
It's supposed to be fun.

528
00:22:38.935 --> 00:22:40.615
I thought you said something interesting about,

529
00:22:40.616 --> 00:22:40.815
you know,

530
00:22:40.855 --> 00:22:43.336
when we are playing for big clubs like Liverpool,

531
00:22:43.496 --> 00:22:44.277
it's all about winning.

532
00:22:45.037 --> 00:22:45.177
Yeah.

533
00:22:45.197 --> 00:22:48.219
You need to understand the fan that just won trophies at the end of the season.

534
00:22:48.639 --> 00:22:48.759
Yeah.

535
00:22:48.999 --> 00:22:49.240
End of.

536
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:51.661
And the manager wants to win.

537
00:22:52.441 --> 00:22:53.882
And he says that.

538
00:22:55.175 --> 00:22:55.795
It's a must.

539
00:22:57.116 --> 00:22:57.677
It's a must.

540
00:22:57.678 --> 00:22:58.417
You must win.

541
00:22:59.578 --> 00:22:59.698
Yeah.

542
00:22:59.699 --> 00:22:59.799
Yeah.

543
00:22:59.800 --> 00:22:59.959
Just,

544
00:23:00.059 --> 00:23:00.259
just,

545
00:23:00.399 --> 00:23:00.719
just the,

546
00:23:00.779 --> 00:23:03.081
I remember when we had the chat,

547
00:23:03.082 --> 00:23:03.782
how many times

548
00:23:04.202 --> 00:23:05.243
Gerard really said to us,

549
00:23:05.523 --> 00:23:06.184
we have to win.

550
00:23:06.644 --> 00:23:07.525
Be a winner a week in,

551
00:23:07.526 --> 00:23:08.005
a week out.

552
00:23:08.738 --> 00:23:09.939
Because you're playing for Liverpool.

553
00:23:09.959 --> 00:23:11.420
You never lose three in a row.

554
00:23:11.540 --> 00:23:11.660
No,

555
00:23:11.820 --> 00:23:12.621
never lose two in a row.

556
00:23:12.801 --> 00:23:13.562
Never lose three.

557
00:23:13.642 --> 00:23:14.522
It's a good team.

558
00:23:15.804 --> 00:23:16.784
And I've come from Leicester,

559
00:23:16.864 --> 00:23:18.286
we're going five or six.

560
00:23:20.167 --> 00:23:22.089
He was really worried after the,

561
00:23:22.109 --> 00:23:23.430
after each international break.

562
00:23:23.886 --> 00:23:44.779
yeah the tough ones because your head was coming from everywhere and your mentality's all over the place you were spanking where are you where are you oh god but just a little bit more on Liverpool when you joined who was the kind of main character in that dressing room because that was a dressing room probably Cara

563
00:23:45.348 --> 00:23:52.222
Cara yeah even though he was young at the time because I came when he was 20 and he's the same age as me but he's a Scouse lad and Scouses are you

564
00:23:53.394 --> 00:23:53.674
Loud.

565
00:23:54.015 --> 00:23:57.136
Yeah.

566
00:23:57.156 --> 00:23:57.777
They're funny though.

567
00:23:58.297 --> 00:24:00.278
He was probably the main character.

568
00:24:00.318 --> 00:24:02.160
We didn't really have loads of...

569
00:24:02.440 --> 00:24:04.496
Gary Mack?

570
00:24:04.497 --> 00:24:04.617
No,

571
00:24:04.737 --> 00:24:05.017
but Gary...

572
00:24:05.018 --> 00:24:05.597
In a different way.

573
00:24:05.777 --> 00:24:06.598
Yeah.

574
00:24:06.618 --> 00:24:09.299
Gary was the senior figure that held everyone together.

575
00:24:10.780 --> 00:24:12.902
We were young lads and you could imagine we would...

576
00:24:13.362 --> 00:24:14.763
If you didn't control us,

577
00:24:14.764 --> 00:24:15.984
we'd be running all over the place.

578
00:24:16.184 --> 00:24:16.444
Did you?

579
00:24:16.964 --> 00:24:17.164
Did he?

580
00:24:17.165 --> 00:24:17.585
He was good.

581
00:24:17.945 --> 00:24:19.246
Them two were brilliant in the midfield.

582
00:24:19.446 --> 00:24:19.646
Yeah.

583
00:24:19.886 --> 00:24:21.887
I think Gary Mack was one of the best ones though,

584
00:24:21.888 --> 00:24:23.308
because as a senior player,

585
00:24:23.309 --> 00:24:24.689
you've got to control everyone.

586
00:24:24.690 --> 00:24:25.810
Yeah.

587
00:24:25.811 --> 00:24:26.751
I'm 20.

588
00:24:26.752 --> 00:24:28.532
I was 19 and a half.

589
00:24:28.533 --> 00:24:29.232
I was 22.

590
00:24:30.033 --> 00:24:31.074
Kara's 22.

591
00:24:31.075 --> 00:24:32.054
Michael's 19.

592
00:24:32.515 --> 00:24:34.136
Stevie's 18 at the time.

593
00:24:34.696 --> 00:24:34.916
Yeah.

594
00:24:35.036 --> 00:24:39.159
So you've got to control all these players and make sure they're pulling them in,

595
00:24:39.179 --> 00:24:40.260
not just running all over the place.

596
00:24:40.261 --> 00:24:40.480
Yeah.

597
00:24:40.820 --> 00:24:41.661
And he was brilliant.

598
00:24:42.281 --> 00:24:44.323
And he was at the front of all the running.

599
00:24:44.915 --> 00:24:47.136
So you're looking at him like 36 at the time.

600
00:24:47.137 --> 00:24:47.817
I'm like,

601
00:24:47.818 --> 00:24:49.038
I'm a 22 year old at the back.

602
00:24:49.158 --> 00:24:49.418
Yeah.

603
00:24:51.220 --> 00:25:01.970
the old man is running it but everyone talks about Gary Mack at Liverpool amazing man dumb guy that we've had on the we've had a few Liverpool guys and his name comes up regularly and he's one that I would have never

604
00:25:03.402 --> 00:25:05.871
thought like but this is the genius of

605
00:25:06.351 --> 00:25:23.046
Gerald Houliard because 36 years old you're not going by 36 yeah he was smart signing yeah he knew exactly what we needed to bring everything together yeah but moving on to your England career obviously you had a phenomenal England career but winning

606
00:25:23.066 --> 00:25:26.728
your first cap for the first team was that when you were at

607
00:25:27.388 --> 00:25:32.930
Liverpool? Leicester Leicester you got a cap when you were at Leicester that's phenomenal as well what was it like

608
00:25:33.591 --> 00:25:51.814
walking into that team because again you must have been overawed with that oh yeah yeah you are at first but like I we go back I'm lucky because I played at 16s so you understand what it means and the quality that you need in training in the games because

609
00:25:51.815 --> 00:25:54.397
I did it at 16s yep and then you do

610
00:25:54.877 --> 00:26:00.262
18s 21s and anything so you understand when you go up to the big boys it's even quicker you you

611
00:26:00.642 --> 00:26:18.751
kid you not you could ring your shirt when you finish training that's the intensity that you're playing at every game every training session is harder than the games yep because everyone seems like they're trying to impress but no it was it was really good at first it's a bit daunting that you're going in and Ian Wright's sat there

612
00:26:19.323 --> 00:26:25.333
Andy Cole's sat there Shira's sat there you're like what what's this

613
00:26:26.030 --> 00:26:26.150
And...

614
00:26:26.610 --> 00:26:30.592
I would have just walked out when I'm not getting a game out of these guys.

615
00:26:30.632 --> 00:26:36.594
But it was a great experience to be around them and put yourself up against them and know you've always got to challenge yourself and that was my thing.

616
00:26:36.614 --> 00:26:38.095
I was always challenging myself okay,

617
00:26:38.355 --> 00:26:40.436
where do I fit within this?

618
00:26:40.956 --> 00:26:42.597
What can I show that's different to you?

619
00:26:43.649 --> 00:26:48.839
Played against Argentina and what's his name?

620
00:26:49.179 --> 00:26:51.524
The ex-Leeds manager.

621
00:26:51.525 --> 00:26:54.849
The one who used to sit on the cooler.

622
00:26:54.949 --> 00:26:55.429
The old guy?

623
00:26:55.430 --> 00:26:55.549
Yes,

624
00:26:55.629 --> 00:26:55.749
sir.

625
00:26:56.902 --> 00:26:57.083
Yeah,

626
00:26:57.084 --> 00:26:57.243
yeah.

627
00:26:57.423 --> 00:26:59.745
He was the manager of Argentina at the time.

628
00:27:00.497 --> 00:27:05.021
And it's funny because I was on the flight and a guy came up to me and said,

629
00:27:05.942 --> 00:27:06.122
oh,

630
00:27:06.222 --> 00:27:06.923
you got me sacked.

631
00:27:07.403 --> 00:27:11.999
I was like a part-time scout for the Argentina team,

632
00:27:12.019 --> 00:27:13.540
but I was doing ESPN as well.

633
00:27:14.020 --> 00:27:14.881
So I used to do ESPN,

634
00:27:14.921 --> 00:27:15.762
watch the Premier League,

635
00:27:15.782 --> 00:27:15.962
blah,

636
00:27:15.963 --> 00:27:16.162
blah.

637
00:27:16.163 --> 00:27:17.543
And he said that I was,

638
00:27:17.944 --> 00:27:18.524
Bielsa told him,

639
00:27:19.633 --> 00:27:20.654
what do you make a Hesky?

640
00:27:20.674 --> 00:27:21.615
He's supposed to be starting.

641
00:27:21.616 --> 00:27:21.875
He said,

642
00:27:21.975 --> 00:27:22.095
no,

643
00:27:22.155 --> 00:27:22.276
no,

644
00:27:22.277 --> 00:27:22.836
he won't start.

645
00:27:22.856 --> 00:27:23.877
It'll be Kevin Phillips,

646
00:27:24.277 --> 00:27:24.457
blah,

647
00:27:25.018 --> 00:27:41.559
because no no he's starting we've heard it's like no he's not good enough he's can't he can't run then within so i started and within 20 minutes they had to pull their captain off because you know back then i just used to run down the channels and just i just knocked the ball and run yeah

648
00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:54.238
and i was this size no one's gonna stop me and yeah just absolutely murdered them and then he said i'd never call me back again obviously you talk about your size uh and stuff like that Did you work?

649
00:27:54.818 --> 00:27:59.760
or were you just playing a lot I was naturally big if you see my family yeah yeah I was naturally big

650
00:28:02.733 --> 00:28:13.185
I was in the gym but I had I had to be careful in the gym because I could get too big yeah I had to be very specific in the gym with what I was doing but yeah I was in because I'd been in the gym from

651
00:28:14.106 --> 00:28:23.970
14, 15 yeah working because my dad used to work in like a youth centre and I'd just go there play football and then go in the gym with everyone else as a kid you

652
00:28:24.814 --> 00:28:39.530
so yeah I did a fair bit of gym work but my family are big both sides more my dad fair enough fair enough you can get away with it but we need to talk about the game you mentioned you've still got the jersey the

653
00:28:39.970 --> 00:28:40.470
5-1

654
00:28:41.111 --> 00:28:47.546
Germany game and you scored the 5th goal can you talk us through

655
00:28:49.790 --> 00:28:50.691
What that would be like,

656
00:28:51.492 --> 00:28:52.572
beating Germany 5-1.

657
00:28:52.573 --> 00:28:52.672
Well,

658
00:28:52.673 --> 00:28:53.813
the build-up was tough because,

659
00:28:53.853 --> 00:28:54.033
again,

660
00:28:54.034 --> 00:28:55.635
we lost the last game at the Old Wembley.

661
00:28:55.715 --> 00:28:56.295
Did he score?

662
00:28:56.475 --> 00:28:57.696
Did the handman score a free kick?

663
00:28:57.976 --> 00:29:03.668
So it's the last game at the Old Wembley and you're losing to your rivals.

664
00:29:04.445 --> 00:29:07.948
Kevin Keegan decided to step down after the game.

665
00:29:08.008 --> 00:29:08.188
Yeah,

666
00:29:08.308 --> 00:29:08.528
correct.

667
00:29:08.529 --> 00:29:09.849
He says he can't do it anymore,

668
00:29:09.889 --> 00:29:10.069
blah,

669
00:29:10.129 --> 00:29:10.810
blah.

670
00:29:10.830 --> 00:29:11.470
I remember this,

671
00:29:11.490 --> 00:29:11.951
yeah.

672
00:29:11.952 --> 00:29:14.112
And then we go to their backyard.

673
00:29:14.113 --> 00:29:15.053
They hadn't lost in

674
00:29:15.413 --> 00:29:16.194
50-plus games at home.

675
00:29:17.426 --> 00:29:18.686
And then they go 1-0 up as well.

676
00:29:18.786 --> 00:29:19.527
It's Sven's first,

677
00:29:19.747 --> 00:29:20.127
I think it's

678
00:29:20.547 --> 00:29:23.060
Sven's first competitive game.

679
00:29:24.556 --> 00:29:26.157
We go 1-0 down after seven minutes.

680
00:29:27.361 --> 00:29:29.262
Dave Seaman makes another save and it's like,

681
00:29:29.322 --> 00:29:30.082
could have been 2-0.

682
00:29:30.810 --> 00:29:31.690
I think we just scored,

683
00:29:34.071 --> 00:29:34.711
Sven was brilliant.

684
00:29:35.111 --> 00:29:35.311
Like

685
00:29:35.671 --> 00:29:37.052
Gerrard, very tactical,

686
00:29:37.332 --> 00:29:39.572
bring a board out and start moving all these pieces around.

687
00:29:39.592 --> 00:29:40.969
You're looking at it and you're saying,

688
00:29:40.989 --> 00:29:41.169
okay,

689
00:29:41.189 --> 00:29:42.909
I understand where I need to be.

690
00:29:43.349 --> 00:29:45.430
Give you the freedom when you're on the board to do whatever you want.

691
00:29:45.590 --> 00:29:45.750
Yeah.

692
00:29:45.990 --> 00:29:47.132
But when you're defensively,

693
00:29:47.212 --> 00:29:48.073
you need to be doing this,

694
00:29:48.113 --> 00:29:48.233
this,

695
00:29:48.273 --> 00:29:48.393
this,

696
00:29:48.433 --> 00:29:48.573
this,

697
00:29:48.574 --> 00:29:48.834
and this.

698
00:29:49.294 --> 00:29:49.615
I was like,

699
00:29:49.675 --> 00:29:49.955
fine.

700
00:29:50.668 --> 00:29:53.231
So we scored at key times.

701
00:29:53.291 --> 00:29:53.952
Michael scored,

702
00:29:54.012 --> 00:29:56.114
Stevie scored just before halftime.

703
00:29:56.731 --> 00:29:57.392
And you'll know.

704
00:29:58.108 --> 00:30:00.129
There's times in the game where managers say,

705
00:30:00.449 --> 00:30:01.669
your focus has got to be

706
00:30:02.273 --> 00:30:06.182
10-10, just before half-time and just after half-time.

707
00:30:07.691 --> 00:30:08.911
And we scored at them two times.

708
00:30:09.399 --> 00:30:10.620
We scored to make it 2-1,

709
00:30:10.660 --> 00:30:15.297
and they probably deserved to either be ahead or at least draw in.

710
00:30:15.837 --> 00:30:17.978
And we went in 2-1 up,

711
00:30:18.586 --> 00:30:20.106
come back after 3-1,

712
00:30:20.226 --> 00:30:20.606
finished.

713
00:30:22.643 --> 00:30:23.663
So you scored the fifth goal.

714
00:30:25.656 --> 00:30:26.156
Where does that...

715
00:30:26.764 --> 00:30:48.210
rank amongst your career highlights was that i think one of the biggest ones the reason i say that is it's it's it's a game that everyone knows yeah i go everywhere literally everywhere i had a one i've got so many good stories as well i had one kid i went to watch my son play and one kid sat in front of me and

716
00:30:49.271 --> 00:30:53.192
he after a half time he turned around said thank you for that game blah I'm looking at him thinking,

717
00:30:53.352 --> 00:30:53.652
howdy.

718
00:30:54.608 --> 00:30:56.669
It's a memory from when he was with his granddad.

719
00:30:56.929 --> 00:30:57.129
Yeah.

720
00:30:57.689 --> 00:30:58.469
Another one,

721
00:31:00.338 --> 00:31:01.598
him and his dad were watching the game.

722
00:31:02.098 --> 00:31:03.059
Went 1-0 down.

723
00:31:03.819 --> 00:31:04.819
His dad was out fuming.

724
00:31:04.820 --> 00:31:05.519
He didn't watch the game.

725
00:31:05.520 --> 00:31:06.940
He just stormed out and left.

726
00:31:07.380 --> 00:31:07.960
Didn't watch the game.

727
00:31:08.836 --> 00:31:13.190
Another one where a guy had a ticket and on the same day,

728
00:31:13.230 --> 00:31:15.290
he's supposed to be a groom at his brother's wedding.

729
00:31:15.746 --> 00:31:15.907
Yeah.

730
00:31:16.419 --> 00:31:16.839
He's like,

731
00:31:17.039 --> 00:31:17.439
what do I do?

732
00:31:20.888 --> 00:31:22.029
All these things.

733
00:31:22.049 --> 00:31:23.469
People have some wonderful stories,

734
00:31:24.190 --> 00:31:26.311
but it's a game that everyone remembers.

735
00:31:26.551 --> 00:31:26.791
Yeah.

736
00:31:27.651 --> 00:31:30.473
And I'm just curious to your answer to this question.

737
00:31:30.613 --> 00:31:30.873
Obviously,

738
00:31:30.893 --> 00:31:33.314
you played with some amazing players.

739
00:31:33.694 --> 00:31:34.534
Who was your favourite

740
00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:36.059
England player to play with?

741
00:31:36.099 --> 00:31:36.359
Michael.

742
00:31:37.015 --> 00:31:37.256
Michael,

743
00:31:37.336 --> 00:31:37.476
yeah,

744
00:31:37.536 --> 00:31:37.656
yeah,

745
00:31:37.696 --> 00:31:37.976
Michael.

746
00:31:38.576 --> 00:31:39.137
Favourite player,

747
00:31:39.177 --> 00:31:39.417
player?

748
00:31:39.637 --> 00:31:39.797
Yeah.

749
00:31:39.897 --> 00:31:40.637
Probably Stevie.

750
00:31:41.201 --> 00:31:41.982
Favourite forward,

751
00:31:42.042 --> 00:31:42.342
Michael.

752
00:31:42.722 --> 00:31:42.902
Yeah.

753
00:31:43.182 --> 00:31:44.343
But Wazza was close.

754
00:31:44.931 --> 00:31:46.072
Wazza was brilliant because...

755
00:31:47.616 --> 00:31:49.076
I know what he wants to do.

756
00:31:49.197 --> 00:31:50.357
He loves getting on the ball,

757
00:31:50.397 --> 00:31:50.857
Wayne Rooney.

758
00:31:51.097 --> 00:31:51.257
Yeah.

759
00:31:51.657 --> 00:31:52.417
Loves getting on the ball.

760
00:31:52.457 --> 00:31:53.738
So what my job is,

761
00:31:54.158 --> 00:31:55.358
create space for him to get on the ball.

762
00:31:55.618 --> 00:31:55.778
Yeah.

763
00:31:55.938 --> 00:32:01.840
So I make him runs to deter defenders from going into the number 10 spot.

764
00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:02.320
Yeah.

765
00:32:03.016 --> 00:32:04.857
To create space for him to go and get on it,

766
00:32:04.897 --> 00:32:07.097
turn and start dribbling and doing what he's doing.

767
00:32:07.117 --> 00:32:07.317
Yeah.

768
00:32:08.158 --> 00:32:09.638
And then I'm there to hold the ball up,

769
00:32:09.658 --> 00:32:11.239
knock it back to him and then let him play.

770
00:32:11.479 --> 00:32:11.919
He was,

771
00:32:12.059 --> 00:32:12.199
yeah,

772
00:32:12.219 --> 00:32:13.179
he was phenomenal as well.

773
00:32:13.755 --> 00:32:14.896
He's one of my favourites.

774
00:32:14.976 --> 00:32:16.136
Michael won the Ballon d'Or.

775
00:32:16.316 --> 00:32:16.436
Yeah.

776
00:32:16.880 --> 00:32:17.040
Oh,

777
00:32:17.041 --> 00:32:17.720
I was at Liverpool.

778
00:32:17.721 --> 00:32:18.221
Yeah.

779
00:32:18.222 --> 00:32:20.493
You know why you want the Ballon d'Or also?

780
00:32:21.905 --> 00:32:23.146
Because of Emil Wark.

781
00:32:23.546 --> 00:32:24.390
Yeah.

782
00:32:24.391 --> 00:32:25.150
I'm pretty sure.

783
00:32:25.370 --> 00:32:25.490
Yeah,

784
00:32:25.550 --> 00:32:28.131
because he scored beautiful goals,

785
00:32:28.667 --> 00:32:29.908
but the movement you made for him.

786
00:32:30.500 --> 00:32:31.340
Yeah,

787
00:32:31.341 --> 00:32:32.361
I think creating space.

788
00:32:32.362 --> 00:32:32.721
You understand?

789
00:32:32.901 --> 00:32:33.841
Yeah.

790
00:32:33.921 --> 00:32:35.182
That goes both ways as well.

791
00:32:35.714 --> 00:32:37.934
So I think for Michael,

792
00:32:39.519 --> 00:32:41.499
as long as you're working with him,

793
00:32:41.959 --> 00:32:42.400
he's going to be,

794
00:32:43.020 --> 00:32:43.560
if you're doing.

795
00:32:43.960 --> 00:32:45.161
You've got too many forwards,

796
00:32:45.741 --> 00:32:47.202
they work in separate,

797
00:32:47.222 --> 00:32:48.383
they don't work together.

798
00:32:48.623 --> 00:32:48.783
Yeah.

799
00:32:49.143 --> 00:32:52.525
I was all about working and I grew up in an environment where you've got to work together.

800
00:32:52.605 --> 00:32:52.805
Yeah.

801
00:32:53.381 --> 00:32:54.142
So my thing was,

802
00:32:54.362 --> 00:32:56.351
how do I gel with this player?

803
00:32:56.611 --> 00:32:56.811
Yeah.

804
00:32:57.031 --> 00:32:57.532
And that's how,

805
00:32:57.932 --> 00:32:58.312
and he was,

806
00:32:58.532 --> 00:32:58.772
again,

807
00:32:58.912 --> 00:32:59.873
he was a phenomenal player.

808
00:32:59.874 --> 00:33:00.894
This year he was on fire.

809
00:33:01.014 --> 00:33:01.234
Yeah,

810
00:33:01.254 --> 00:33:02.514
he was phenomenal.

811
00:33:02.695 --> 00:33:02.915
Yeah.

812
00:33:03.371 --> 00:33:07.673
But would you say a lot of other guys now are just in it for themselves?

813
00:33:07.713 --> 00:33:07.893
Like,

814
00:33:07.913 --> 00:33:09.034
want to score more goals?

815
00:33:09.074 --> 00:33:09.694
It's not just now.

816
00:33:10.075 --> 00:33:10.515
Or always?

817
00:33:10.535 --> 00:33:10.655
Yeah,

818
00:33:10.656 --> 00:33:11.715
it's been like that for,

819
00:33:12.056 --> 00:33:12.176
for,

820
00:33:12.988 --> 00:33:13.329
Forever,

821
00:33:13.389 --> 00:33:13.809
really.

822
00:33:14.309 --> 00:33:17.507
You've got some players who will lose a game.

823
00:33:17.547 --> 00:33:17.668
See,

824
00:33:17.669 --> 00:33:18.148
I've done my job,

825
00:33:18.149 --> 00:33:18.688
I've scored two.

826
00:33:19.089 --> 00:33:19.929
Yeah.

827
00:33:20.249 --> 00:33:21.150
You've lost a game.

828
00:33:21.230 --> 00:33:21.470
Yeah.

829
00:33:23.852 --> 00:33:24.993
That doesn't make sense in my head.

830
00:33:25.593 --> 00:33:25.833
Yeah.

831
00:33:26.710 --> 00:33:32.234
But it might be because I'm from an environment that is winning and losing is key.

832
00:33:33.739 --> 00:33:34.680
We could get relegated.

833
00:33:34.700 --> 00:33:36.061
Do you know what I mean?

834
00:33:36.121 --> 00:33:36.321
Yeah.

835
00:33:36.661 --> 00:33:37.902
It's all about fighting at Leicester.

836
00:33:38.767 --> 00:33:40.488
As you see what's happening there now.

837
00:33:41.344 --> 00:33:45.009
You need players who are ready to put it down and fight.

838
00:33:45.010 --> 00:33:45.229
Yeah.

839
00:33:45.569 --> 00:33:45.689
No,

840
00:33:45.789 --> 00:33:46.069
I mean,

841
00:33:46.070 --> 00:33:47.930
we were talking about that result on the way down as well.

842
00:33:47.990 --> 00:33:50.526
They're getting beat 4-0 off Oxford.

843
00:33:50.607 --> 00:33:51.907
And you've still got a good squad there.

844
00:33:52.483 --> 00:33:52.983
At home.

845
00:33:53.283 --> 00:33:53.503
Yeah.

846
00:33:54.003 --> 00:33:55.772
That was a proper shocker.

847
00:33:55.932 --> 00:33:56.812
You said they've got a good squad.

848
00:33:56.832 --> 00:33:58.012
They've got a lot of young players,

849
00:33:58.353 --> 00:33:59.073
which is needed.

850
00:33:59.333 --> 00:33:59.893
Yeah.

851
00:34:00.053 --> 00:34:00.513
But you need some...

852
00:34:00.953 --> 00:34:01.934
We're talking about Gary Mack.

853
00:34:02.154 --> 00:34:02.334
Yeah.

854
00:34:02.474 --> 00:34:03.794
You need senior players that can help them.

855
00:34:03.814 --> 00:34:04.174
Yeah.

856
00:34:04.510 --> 00:34:05.511
They're going to give you all,

857
00:34:05.631 --> 00:34:06.071
these kids.

858
00:34:06.072 --> 00:34:06.831
They're going to give you all.

859
00:34:07.447 --> 00:34:08.227
But at some stage,

860
00:34:08.228 --> 00:34:10.668
they might come up against it where they need someone else to...

861
00:34:11.080 --> 00:34:14.314
to help galvanise them and help them get through this game yeah

862
00:34:14.794 --> 00:34:30.483
I haven't seen that yet when you're young you've got the legs yeah when you get older you think you know you think about the game yeah when you're young you don't think too much about this just want to play and show to the manager you can prove you're good enough to stay in the team yeah so

863
00:34:31.588 --> 00:34:38.432
I'm just curious see Leicester is the Thai guy still involved yes he's still there still the owners yeah I didn't know

864
00:34:39.817 --> 00:34:54.498
there's a hell of a drop in it the thing is you overspend it comes back to haunt you yeah they should never have been relegated with the squad that they had they should never have been relegated yeah but then you are relegated and then then

865
00:34:54.639 --> 00:34:56.020
you've got to figure out how are we going to

866
00:34:56.809 --> 00:35:14.517
consolidate we cannot afford to keep paying these wages we can't afford to have these players just sitting around yeah so then you just you start slowly tearing the squad apart yeah bring young lads in which they have we've got some fantastic young lads to be fair we've sold some

867
00:35:15.317 --> 00:35:16.218
Trey Nyhoney's gone to

868
00:35:16.914 --> 00:35:23.879
Liverpool yeah Munger's gone to Man City he's now he's in Swansea Motsey just left he's gone to

869
00:35:25.080 --> 00:35:26.401
Man City as well you

870
00:35:27.537 --> 00:35:41.165
so they sold they actually are producing but none of them actually get to the first yeah but going back to the England thing yep you obviously played with some phenomenal players but if you had to pick because it's a question that comes up in every podcast

871
00:35:41.785 --> 00:35:45.286
Stevie G Frank Lampard or Paul Scholes if you could only pick one Stevie

872
00:35:45.646 --> 00:35:54.889
Stevie yeah yeah yeah Stevie but Scholes was brilliant Lamp as well Lamps as well they were all phenomenal players you can't take away from what they've all done yeah

873
00:35:55.369 --> 00:35:56.209
Scholes was brilliant

874
00:35:57.029 --> 00:36:04.563
Stevie because I played longer with him and at the end of the day he can take a game by the scruff of the neck on his own and change it

875
00:36:05.204 --> 00:36:14.623
I don't know if the others can do that on their own just take the ball and go and do something yeah they'll obviously need others to be contributing in that

876
00:36:14.964 --> 00:36:21.989
Stevie just give him the ball let him do his thing manager wise you obviously work with

877
00:36:22.129 --> 00:36:25.632
various different managers who was you the best one that understood you the best

878
00:36:26.132 --> 00:36:31.063
Martin O'Neill and Gerald Holier I can't I can't take away one if I'm honest with them two

879
00:36:31.824 --> 00:36:41.270
Martin gave me the the freedom to do what I was good at and what I wanted which was get the ball turn run with the ball

880
00:36:42.319 --> 00:36:42.879
I remember

881
00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:51.117
I remember I can't remember who he played but I remember getting the ball controlling it laying it back to Robbie Savage he took a touch and then gave it away

882
00:36:51.857 --> 00:37:10.388
managed to go to me i'm like what's that what's he having to go to me for and then come yeah what are you doing that for i'm like i just gave him the balls he says what is he gonna do that you can't i looked at him and just get the ball turn and run i went yeah you're right so and

883
00:37:10.389 --> 00:37:21.365
then the funny thing with with martin he didn't coach didn't do any of the coaching but man management had a group of lads that would run for a bit orphan yeah

884
00:37:22.461 --> 00:37:24.022
And that's what he's getting at Celtic now.

885
00:37:24.703 --> 00:37:25.504
He's given up the job,

886
00:37:25.744 --> 00:37:28.286
then he has to come back and galvanise him again,

887
00:37:28.546 --> 00:37:29.187
then give it up again,

888
00:37:29.188 --> 00:37:30.288
then come back and do it again.

889
00:37:31.028 --> 00:37:31.609
It's down to,

890
00:37:31.849 --> 00:37:33.250
there's a place for management,

891
00:37:33.270 --> 00:37:35.152
there's a place to get the players on your side.

892
00:37:35.612 --> 00:37:36.953
Then there's a place for coaches.

893
00:37:37.374 --> 00:37:37.534
Yeah.

894
00:37:37.614 --> 00:37:38.094
Coaching.

895
00:37:38.795 --> 00:37:38.915
Yeah.

896
00:37:38.916 --> 00:37:40.596
And understanding the tactics and all that.

897
00:37:40.636 --> 00:37:41.057
That's not him.

898
00:37:41.497 --> 00:37:41.637
Yeah.

899
00:37:41.857 --> 00:37:43.078
He's the other part of it.

900
00:37:43.699 --> 00:37:45.801
Did O'Neill ever give the kind of fear factor?

901
00:37:46.241 --> 00:37:46.762
I don't know,

902
00:37:47.142 --> 00:37:47.622
Martin O'Neill,

903
00:37:47.682 --> 00:37:49.144
did he ever give people the fear factor?

904
00:37:49.764 --> 00:37:50.425
He was horrible.

905
00:37:50.426 --> 00:37:50.805
He wasn't nice.

906
00:37:51.125 --> 00:38:07.431
because he worked with Cluffy and stuff I would always imagine guys like Cluffy you would shit yourself you'd be like fuck no one wanted to ask him any questions no one wanted to go into his office all they wanted to do was keep him happy and once you kept him happy he'd keep you happy and

907
00:38:07.432 --> 00:38:19.629
a lot of the time when you keep players happy what is it days off and stuff like that he was brilliant at that giving lads days off understanding what they needed for their families and stuff like that staff at the training ground

908
00:38:20.065 --> 00:38:22.027
Not one of them has a bad word to say about Martin.

909
00:38:22.327 --> 00:38:22.847
Jeez.

910
00:38:22.947 --> 00:38:23.067
No,

911
00:38:23.247 --> 00:38:24.628
understands when their birthday is,

912
00:38:25.265 --> 00:38:26.326
when their kid's birthday is.

913
00:38:26.346 --> 00:38:28.867
I'm talking about cleaners.

914
00:38:28.887 --> 00:38:29.888
I'm talking about chefs.

915
00:38:29.928 --> 00:38:30.849
I'm talking about all them people.

916
00:38:30.909 --> 00:38:31.149
Yeah.

917
00:38:31.881 --> 00:38:32.922
They all love him.

918
00:38:33.242 --> 00:38:34.563
But he was brilliant.

919
00:38:35.492 --> 00:38:36.352
And Gerald was similar.

920
00:38:36.633 --> 00:38:40.115
Gerald understood the one-on-one with the players.

921
00:38:40.435 --> 00:38:40.615
Yeah.

922
00:38:40.675 --> 00:38:41.236
Understood that.

923
00:38:42.048 --> 00:38:43.109
And then obviously tactically,

924
00:38:43.110 --> 00:38:43.929
he was a different level.

925
00:38:44.474 --> 00:38:47.096
Did you ever have a bust up with any of those managers?

926
00:38:47.576 --> 00:38:47.896
Martin.

927
00:38:48.296 --> 00:38:48.497
Martin.

928
00:38:48.498 --> 00:38:48.917
Yeah.

929
00:38:49.609 --> 00:38:50.450
But that was later on.

930
00:38:50.710 --> 00:38:54.152
Yeah.

931
00:38:54.153 --> 00:38:54.552
Aston Villa.

932
00:38:54.872 --> 00:38:55.052
Yeah.

933
00:38:55.273 --> 00:38:55.453
Yeah,

934
00:38:55.454 --> 00:38:56.033
it was later on.

935
00:38:56.781 --> 00:38:57.582
But yeah,

936
00:38:58.891 --> 00:38:59.752
when you get older,

937
00:38:59.832 --> 00:39:04.350
you've got your own way of saying stuff and portraying it.

938
00:39:04.410 --> 00:39:04.931
So yeah,

939
00:39:04.932 --> 00:39:05.671
it just wasn't,

940
00:39:05.691 --> 00:39:06.372
we didn't click.

941
00:39:07.084 --> 00:39:07.925
But he still picked me.

942
00:39:08.365 --> 00:39:08.545
Yeah.

943
00:39:08.805 --> 00:39:08.926
Yeah,

944
00:39:08.927 --> 00:39:09.666
he still picked me.

945
00:39:09.686 --> 00:39:12.829
I still wanted to run for a bit more for him.

946
00:39:13.689 --> 00:39:15.230
I have nothing bad to say about him.

947
00:39:15.531 --> 00:39:17.332
I think if you are clearer as a manager,

948
00:39:17.352 --> 00:39:18.253
you're understanding.

949
00:39:19.045 --> 00:39:21.627
From the age to 20 to 24,

950
00:39:21.628 --> 00:39:22.747
you do what you want with the player.

951
00:39:23.108 --> 00:39:23.288
Yeah.

952
00:39:23.388 --> 00:39:24.909
From 24 to 28,

953
00:39:25.189 --> 00:39:25.949
the player show you,

954
00:39:26.009 --> 00:39:26.189
boss,

955
00:39:26.209 --> 00:39:26.570
you need me.

956
00:39:27.010 --> 00:39:27.450
Yeah.

957
00:39:27.451 --> 00:39:28.050
And after 29,

958
00:39:28.170 --> 00:39:30.208
30 years old,

959
00:39:30.209 --> 00:39:32.669
this is where the player come back toward the manager,

960
00:39:32.849 --> 00:39:33.089
you know?

961
00:39:33.149 --> 00:39:33.489
Yeah.

962
00:39:34.870 --> 00:39:35.110
You know,

963
00:39:35.111 --> 00:39:35.871
it's nearly the end.

964
00:39:36.191 --> 00:39:36.331
Yeah.

965
00:39:36.332 --> 00:39:36.711
So it's,

966
00:39:37.672 --> 00:39:38.012
that's why,

967
00:39:38.013 --> 00:39:38.232
you know,

968
00:39:38.292 --> 00:39:39.153
if you're a good manager,

969
00:39:39.173 --> 00:39:39.973
if you understand this.

970
00:39:40.894 --> 00:39:41.554
Martin was brilliant.

971
00:39:41.814 --> 00:39:42.094
Martin,

972
00:39:42.095 --> 00:39:42.875
we had a good,

973
00:39:42.975 --> 00:39:44.135
especially at Villa,

974
00:39:44.156 --> 00:39:44.836
we had a really,

975
00:39:44.896 --> 00:39:45.516
really good group.

976
00:39:45.836 --> 00:39:46.517
We just didn't have...

977
00:39:47.221 --> 00:39:49.543
It was that little bit that we just lacked.

978
00:39:49.604 --> 00:39:50.905
We were trying to break into the top four.

979
00:39:51.305 --> 00:39:52.466
We finished top six every year.

980
00:39:52.747 --> 00:39:52.967
Yeah.

981
00:39:53.848 --> 00:39:55.830
We're just slowly trying to break in.

982
00:39:56.250 --> 00:39:56.911
After Liverpool,

983
00:39:57.211 --> 00:39:57.792
you went on to

984
00:39:58.352 --> 00:39:58.713
Birmingham.

985
00:40:00.030 --> 00:40:00.450
and obviously

986
00:40:00.910 --> 00:40:01.791
Wigan, Villa,

987
00:40:02.291 --> 00:40:02.652
Newcastle,

988
00:40:02.692 --> 00:40:11.881
Jets and Bolton I want to touch on onwards after Liverpool what made you decide to move on?

989
00:40:12.594 --> 00:40:14.155
I'd been told by the then

990
00:40:15.236 --> 00:40:15.896
CEO that

991
00:40:17.569 --> 00:40:21.656
Cissé was coming in and I had to leave I said no,

992
00:40:21.657 --> 00:40:21.736
no,

993
00:40:21.737 --> 00:40:25.899
I'll fight for my place because the reality is I knew that I would have played the way that I play,

994
00:40:26.604 --> 00:40:27.565
you need a player like that

995
00:40:29.818 --> 00:40:56.297
because you would have been that old 26 yeah 26 but I was told no I won't play and then there becomes that point where you're like if I'm being told I'm not going to play what am I going to do just sit there and collect money yeah I said no no let me just go and play some football somewhere no disrespect to Birmingham but they came in Steve Bruce sat down with Steve Bruce in my house and he talked me through everything and I went there started

996
00:40:56.337 --> 00:40:56.497
well

997
00:40:57.453 --> 00:40:58.334
In the sense of,

998
00:40:59.454 --> 00:41:00.054
it was tough.

999
00:41:01.455 --> 00:41:03.640
Because I've gone from being with Stevie,

1000
00:41:03.680 --> 00:41:04.561
being with these guys,

1001
00:41:05.633 --> 00:41:05.753
who,

1002
00:41:07.482 --> 00:41:08.162
football is football,

1003
00:41:08.202 --> 00:41:09.383
but when you're in it,

1004
00:41:09.859 --> 00:41:13.562
you realise who's top and who's level and who's just a footballer.

1005
00:41:13.602 --> 00:41:17.368
I would think at Liverpool,

1006
00:41:17.369 --> 00:41:18.148
you've got to play forward.

1007
00:41:18.188 --> 00:41:19.009
You've got to wrap balls in,

1008
00:41:19.010 --> 00:41:20.870
everything's got to be done quick and crisp.

1009
00:41:21.630 --> 00:41:23.171
I'm making runs and no one's even looked up.

1010
00:41:23.471 --> 00:41:23.711
Yeah.

1011
00:41:24.788 --> 00:41:24.908
So,

1012
00:41:25.148 --> 00:41:25.308
yeah.

1013
00:41:26.985 --> 00:41:30.387
I'd gone from that where I'm getting Stevie G just wrapping balls into me.

1014
00:41:30.847 --> 00:41:33.209
I've got to be alert and control it on the chest,

1015
00:41:33.210 --> 00:41:34.049
on whatever,

1016
00:41:34.069 --> 00:41:34.930
however I've got to control it.

1017
00:41:34.931 --> 00:41:35.590
I've got to control it.

1018
00:41:36.174 --> 00:41:36.615
To now,

1019
00:41:36.635 --> 00:41:38.896
everyone's going side to side and I'm just stood there thinking,

1020
00:41:39.056 --> 00:41:40.737
I'm making runs but no one's even looked up.

1021
00:41:41.785 --> 00:41:41.906
So

1022
00:41:42.246 --> 00:41:43.747
I had to adjust there.

1023
00:41:44.207 --> 00:41:46.712
And then we'd gone from being,

1024
00:41:46.932 --> 00:41:48.713
I think Birmingham's been up there now three,

1025
00:41:48.753 --> 00:41:49.554
four seasons now.

1026
00:41:50.446 --> 00:41:54.452
And I think they were trying to transition into something different.

1027
00:41:54.612 --> 00:41:54.792
Yeah.

1028
00:41:55.833 --> 00:41:56.113
Better.

1029
00:41:56.962 --> 00:41:57.542
But it wasn't,

1030
00:41:58.063 --> 00:42:01.225
we got a load of players in and it just didn't fit who we were.

1031
00:42:02.878 --> 00:42:05.161
The best player was Damian Johnson who worked.

1032
00:42:06.706 --> 00:42:07.987
And when you know,

1033
00:42:08.107 --> 00:42:09.568
when your best player is like that,

1034
00:42:09.728 --> 00:42:13.018
then you know all these other players that you're buying,

1035
00:42:13.019 --> 00:42:13.519
they're not going to,

1036
00:42:13.520 --> 00:42:14.300
they're not going to fit.

1037
00:42:14.720 --> 00:42:14.900
Yeah.

1038
00:42:14.920 --> 00:42:15.541
It just didn't fit.

1039
00:42:15.921 --> 00:42:17.362
And then went on to Wigan,

1040
00:42:19.263 --> 00:42:20.124
which was good actually.

1041
00:42:21.297 --> 00:42:26.125
Wigan is a strange one because there's zero pressure.

1042
00:42:27.313 --> 00:42:29.194
We had an amazing team.

1043
00:42:30.195 --> 00:42:30.755
Valencia,

1044
00:42:30.955 --> 00:42:31.735
Palacios,

1045
00:42:31.955 --> 00:42:32.776
Mario Melchior,

1046
00:42:32.836 --> 00:42:33.396
myself,

1047
00:42:33.636 --> 00:42:34.597
Titus Bramble,

1048
00:42:35.153 --> 00:42:36.113
Chris Kirkland.

1049
00:42:36.614 --> 00:42:37.874
We had some good players.

1050
00:42:38.795 --> 00:42:39.795
Mano Figueroa,

1051
00:42:40.575 --> 00:42:41.196
we had some good,

1052
00:42:41.356 --> 00:42:41.756
really,

1053
00:42:41.856 --> 00:42:44.217
really good players and we did okay.

1054
00:42:45.065 --> 00:42:51.877
But then it becomes a point where a bid will be put on the table and you're at a club that will just go.

1055
00:42:52.985 --> 00:42:58.497
put another 50 grand on that put another 100 grand on that do you know what I mean so

1056
00:42:59.378 --> 00:43:17.224
Valencia left Palacios left I left yeah it just started slowly started to take away the essence of what you got there nah I reckon they went through a period where I thought they wouldn't we wouldn't FA Cup at all yeah back to Villa would you always say was Roy Keane there as well no

1057
00:43:19.125 --> 00:43:21.326
I didn't know if Roy Keane was following him around at that point or not.

1058
00:43:21.366 --> 00:43:21.506
No,

1059
00:43:21.507 --> 00:43:22.686
I think that was a bit later.

1060
00:43:22.846 --> 00:43:24.707
But that was national team.

1061
00:43:24.708 --> 00:43:24.947
Yeah,

1062
00:43:25.187 --> 00:43:25.927
that's right.

1063
00:43:26.027 --> 00:43:26.367
I think

1064
00:43:28.172 --> 00:43:30.608
Paul Lambert brought in

1065
00:43:30.988 --> 00:43:31.449
Roy Keane,

1066
00:43:31.450 --> 00:43:31.849
I believe.

1067
00:43:32.209 --> 00:43:32.389
Yeah,

1068
00:43:32.849 --> 00:43:33.289
that was it.

1069
00:43:34.009 --> 00:43:35.350
But Villa going from

1070
00:43:36.150 --> 00:43:37.506
Birmingham, Wigan,

1071
00:43:37.546 --> 00:43:38.907
then you're going back to a big,

1072
00:43:38.967 --> 00:43:39.727
big club like that.

1073
00:43:40.223 --> 00:43:41.043
A big club again.

1074
00:43:41.083 --> 00:43:41.423
Was that,

1075
00:43:41.803 --> 00:43:42.104
again,

1076
00:43:42.105 --> 00:43:44.812
a different expectation?

1077
00:43:44.832 --> 00:43:46.112
Oh yeah,

1078
00:43:46.113 --> 00:43:46.513
100%.

1079
00:43:48.353 --> 00:43:50.014
But I was ready for it again.

1080
00:43:50.315 --> 00:43:51.135
Yeah.

1081
00:43:52.024 --> 00:43:52.324
By the way,

1082
00:43:53.125 --> 00:43:55.706
I forced my way back into the national team at Wigan.

1083
00:43:56.183 --> 00:43:57.003
I think I was the first

1084
00:43:57.964 --> 00:44:00.385
Wigan player to play for England.

1085
00:44:00.705 --> 00:44:00.865
Yep.

1086
00:44:01.678 --> 00:44:02.678
I know Kirky did it,

1087
00:44:02.679 --> 00:44:06.785
but he was on loan from Liverpool at the time.

1088
00:44:06.786 --> 00:44:07.166
So yeah,

1089
00:44:08.186 --> 00:44:09.607
made my way back into the national team.

1090
00:44:09.608 --> 00:44:11.749
So I played and then moved to Villa.

1091
00:44:12.497 --> 00:44:12.898
Huge club.

1092
00:44:12.958 --> 00:44:13.778
I'm from Leicester,

1093
00:44:13.779 --> 00:44:17.565
so I know what the size of the club means and everything.

1094
00:44:19.606 --> 00:44:23.389
But it was nice to go back into that environment where you're playing European football.

1095
00:44:24.090 --> 00:44:27.493
Your expectation is super high.

1096
00:44:27.773 --> 00:44:27.893
Yeah.

1097
00:44:29.675 --> 00:44:30.796
The pressures of that.

1098
00:44:31.924 --> 00:44:32.425
You live for that,

1099
00:44:32.445 --> 00:44:32.865
to be honest.

1100
00:44:33.826 --> 00:44:34.847
I know people say no,

1101
00:44:35.127 --> 00:44:36.905
but you actually do live for that.

1102
00:44:37.305 --> 00:44:38.843
Yeah.

1103
00:44:38.844 --> 00:44:39.203
And obviously,

1104
00:44:40.752 --> 00:44:41.152
after that,

1105
00:44:41.153 --> 00:44:41.913
you went to Bolton.

1106
00:44:43.146 --> 00:44:44.167
What was that like as a club?

1107
00:44:45.487 --> 00:44:46.889
Because they weren't...

1108
00:44:46.929 --> 00:44:47.369
You're struggling.

1109
00:44:47.649 --> 00:44:47.790
Yeah,

1110
00:44:47.791 --> 00:44:49.753
they were struggling at that point.

1111
00:44:49.754 --> 00:44:49.874
So

1112
00:44:50.695 --> 00:44:52.940
I was actually training at Blackburn.

1113
00:44:54.223 --> 00:44:58.238
Paul Robinson got me in to help me get just training,

1114
00:44:58.519 --> 00:44:59.361
training with the 21s.

1115
00:45:00.066 --> 00:45:00.566
And,

1116
00:45:00.686 --> 00:45:01.167
um,

1117
00:45:02.531 --> 00:45:03.131
I think,

1118
00:45:04.008 --> 00:45:05.969
so there's a guy that does a lot of media,

1119
00:45:06.069 --> 00:45:07.729
used to do a lot of media stuff at Leicester.

1120
00:45:08.690 --> 00:45:09.010
And,

1121
00:45:09.050 --> 00:45:09.510
uh,

1122
00:45:09.530 --> 00:45:10.731
he's friends with

1123
00:45:11.231 --> 00:45:12.211
Lenny, friends with

1124
00:45:13.232 --> 00:45:14.393
Gary Parker and all them.

1125
00:45:15.189 --> 00:45:16.289
And he's gone,

1126
00:45:17.322 --> 00:45:18.282
Parks wants you to come up,

1127
00:45:18.442 --> 00:45:18.802
um,

1128
00:45:19.262 --> 00:45:20.183
come and train with

1129
00:45:20.603 --> 00:45:21.243
Bolton, blah,

1130
00:45:21.383 --> 00:45:21.784
And I went,

1131
00:45:22.024 --> 00:45:22.164
yeah,

1132
00:45:22.165 --> 00:45:22.464
no problem.

1133
00:45:23.624 --> 00:45:23.744
So

1134
00:45:25.169 --> 00:45:29.426
I went to go and train with Bolton and then.

1135
00:45:30.586 --> 00:45:31.406
One minute I go from

1136
00:45:32.827 --> 00:45:34.327
Blackburn to go and train with Bolton,

1137
00:45:34.647 --> 00:45:34.967
and he goes,

1138
00:45:35.027 --> 00:45:35.148
oh,

1139
00:45:35.149 --> 00:45:38.544
do you fancy playing in a game with 21's game on tomorrow?

1140
00:45:39.013 --> 00:45:39.133
Yeah,

1141
00:45:39.134 --> 00:45:39.453
no problem.

1142
00:45:40.293 --> 00:45:40.993
Went and played on that.

1143
00:45:41.985 --> 00:45:42.925
Played 45 minutes.

1144
00:45:42.945 --> 00:45:43.786
Hadn't played for a while.

1145
00:45:44.290 --> 00:45:45.030
Played 45 minutes.

1146
00:45:45.490 --> 00:45:45.730
Okay,

1147
00:45:45.930 --> 00:45:47.251
do you fancy signing?

1148
00:45:48.135 --> 00:45:48.295
Yeah,

1149
00:45:48.395 --> 00:45:48.935
no problem.

1150
00:45:49.511 --> 00:45:49.932
Signed,

1151
00:45:50.232 --> 00:45:50.732
first game,

1152
00:45:52.748 --> 00:45:53.208
Blackburn,

1153
00:45:53.549 --> 00:45:53.909
at home,

1154
00:45:53.989 --> 00:45:54.289
scored.

1155
00:45:55.269 --> 00:45:57.410
But I'd been training with Blackburn for three weeks,

1156
00:45:57.411 --> 00:45:57.910
four weeks?

1157
00:45:58.150 --> 00:45:58.370
Yeah.

1158
00:46:00.934 --> 00:46:14.826
nothing came of it I was just training with him and then obviously went to Bolton and then played but it was because of Lenny that got me in there to be fair which was good it was just tough because there was no money promised this promised that

1159
00:46:15.266 --> 00:46:27.254
I think Lenny was looking at all these players and agreeing like they can have this and they can have that and they were saying no you can't have that but you can have this free player yeah Yeah.

1160
00:46:28.030 --> 00:46:44.379
that's football though sometimes but the reality is if you're being honest with the manager he'll be able to figure that out he'll be able to figure out but the fact that you keep telling him yes you can have that you can have that and then pulling the rug from under his feet not good but obviously

1161
00:46:44.439 --> 00:46:47.358
you had a phenomenal playing career

1162
00:46:48.266 --> 00:46:55.693
I want to know who was the toughest guy you came up against defender wise who you hated playing against I didn't hate playing against anyone to be honest with you I just loved the challenge

1163
00:46:56.433 --> 00:46:56.994
I loved Bye.

1164
00:46:57.034 --> 00:46:58.654
Challengers Sol Campbell was tough

1165
00:46:59.015 --> 00:47:00.555
Yeah Sol was very tough

1166
00:47:01.115 --> 00:47:04.656
Big boy Yeah And then Walter Samuel Was one of the toughest

1167
00:47:05.096 --> 00:47:07.617
God He was at Roma When we played Roma Yes

1168
00:47:08.553 --> 00:47:09.954
Oh my goodness Was he not a dirty

1169
00:47:11.038 --> 00:47:13.759
Bandit as well I think so Yeah Well it came out later

1170
00:47:14.159 --> 00:47:15.279
Yeah It came out later

1171
00:47:15.859 --> 00:47:16.559
That yeah

1172
00:47:17.119 --> 00:47:22.225
He was a dirty guy Yeah But yeah Let's not talk about that

1173
00:47:22.905 --> 00:47:25.946
Yeah Yeah so them two They were just Tough tough

1174
00:47:26.246 --> 00:47:40.556
tough defenders strong powerful everything so yeah they would be my toughest toughest and out of your playing career who was your funniest teammate I think

1175
00:47:41.097 --> 00:47:44.647
Cara Cara yeah Cara Jamie Cara funny yeah he was funny

1176
00:47:46.128 --> 00:47:46.749
Peggy was

1177
00:47:47.249 --> 00:47:53.314
Peggy was Peggy off exit I had him at Leicester as well and he was good he was funny

1178
00:47:54.370 --> 00:47:55.771
but yeah there was

1179
00:47:56.512 --> 00:48:12.176
Mike Pollitt yeah when I was up wigging with him he's from Bolton just nuts was Bullard at wigging at that time just left just left because he comes across quite a funny guy as well yeah him and apparently him and

1180
00:48:12.596 --> 00:48:14.037
Mike Pollitt together yeah

1181
00:48:15.138 --> 00:48:22.818
Jesus yeah talking about stuff like that what was the best dressing room prank that you've ever seen

1182
00:48:23.262 --> 00:48:23.763
And from who?

1183
00:48:26.567 --> 00:48:27.308
There must have been some...

1184
00:48:27.309 --> 00:48:27.408
No,

1185
00:48:27.409 --> 00:48:27.528
no,

1186
00:48:27.529 --> 00:48:27.648
no,

1187
00:48:27.808 --> 00:48:28.309
loads of...

1188
00:48:28.889 --> 00:48:29.009
No,

1189
00:48:29.310 --> 00:48:29.650
I didn't...

1190
00:48:30.938 --> 00:48:31.999
I had one at youth team,

1191
00:48:33.476 --> 00:48:34.817
which was probably a bad one.

1192
00:48:34.818 --> 00:48:37.159
And we did it to one lad who got arachnophobia.

1193
00:48:38.919 --> 00:48:45.252
And we took his sock off and we turned it inside out and put a spider in and then tied it.

1194
00:48:46.208 --> 00:48:46.449
You know,

1195
00:48:46.450 --> 00:48:49.271
you mess about with people's shoes and tying knots and all that.

1196
00:48:49.571 --> 00:48:52.814
So he thought the actual joke was the tying of the knot in his sock.

1197
00:48:53.014 --> 00:49:13.254
yeah so he's untied and then he's put his hand in and his kid you know he's like this oh man and he locked himself in the boot room never came out he didn't come out for the rest of the day or something like that he was just in there and when you look back you're like that's quite bad isn't it because that is serious oh yeah yeah serious stuff isn't it so yeah

1198
00:49:13.255 --> 00:49:17.422
that's proper trauma yeah

1199
00:49:17.662 --> 00:49:37.530
that's not good I would be the same with a rat or anything I've got like a phobia do you understand and imagine you put your hand in a grub yeah that would give me the cold fear in fact I remember there was a guy on I'm a Celeb a guy called Dean Gaffney who used to be in and see the fear in his face when he was touching like rats or whatever in there you just seen

1200
00:49:37.550 --> 00:49:42.748
the fucking fear see this is the thing with that I'm a celebrity don't go in

1201
00:49:43.769 --> 00:49:44.509
I can't do all that

1202
00:49:45.650 --> 00:49:46.870
I just couldn't do it no you

1203
00:49:47.974 --> 00:49:48.576
You'd never ever,

1204
00:49:48.736 --> 00:49:50.359
not even for a couple of million?

1205
00:49:50.620 --> 00:49:50.740
No.

1206
00:49:53.797 --> 00:49:53.917
No.

1207
00:49:55.302 --> 00:49:55.964
You guys got to swear.

1208
00:49:55.965 --> 00:49:58.168
And the funny thing,

1209
00:49:58.169 --> 00:49:59.571
my dad could do anything.

1210
00:49:59.871 --> 00:50:01.034
He'd put his hand in anything.

1211
00:50:01.436 --> 00:50:01.636
Yeah.

1212
00:50:01.816 --> 00:50:02.077
Yeah,

1213
00:50:02.097 --> 00:50:02.677
a snake.

1214
00:50:03.277 --> 00:50:03.738
We went to

1215
00:50:06.151 --> 00:50:07.012
Florida Disney World.

1216
00:50:07.252 --> 00:50:07.912
Yeah.

1217
00:50:08.212 --> 00:50:10.554
We had a house and we had all the family there and all that.

1218
00:50:10.555 --> 00:50:11.915
This was going back probably about

1219
00:50:12.783 --> 00:50:13.404
20 years.

1220
00:50:13.704 --> 00:50:14.244
Yeah.

1221
00:50:14.245 --> 00:50:16.006
And he's seen a snake and he just went after the snake.

1222
00:50:16.026 --> 00:50:16.246
I'm like,

1223
00:50:16.247 --> 00:50:17.266
what are you going after the snake for?

1224
00:50:17.267 --> 00:50:18.487
You don't even know what snake that is.

1225
00:50:18.728 --> 00:50:18.948
Yeah.

1226
00:50:19.048 --> 00:50:21.670
He just dived in there to try and pull this snake out.

1227
00:50:22.346 --> 00:50:22.586
Like,

1228
00:50:22.746 --> 00:50:23.347
Jesus.

1229
00:50:23.787 --> 00:50:23.907
Ah,

1230
00:50:23.908 --> 00:50:25.288
it's fucking dangerous stuff.

1231
00:50:26.249 --> 00:50:26.429
Nah,

1232
00:50:26.430 --> 00:50:28.390
I'm a bit of a pussy when it comes to stuff like that.

1233
00:50:30.171 --> 00:50:30.412
But...

1234
00:50:31.356 --> 00:50:33.537
So you would never do it,

1235
00:50:33.538 --> 00:50:35.758
but what does Emil Heskey do nowadays?

1236
00:50:35.759 --> 00:50:37.900
Because I know you were involved in the women's team at Leicester.

1237
00:50:37.901 --> 00:50:37.980
Yeah,

1238
00:50:37.981 --> 00:50:42.162
I was involved in the women's team at Leicester for a little bit and the boys on the 18s.

1239
00:50:42.442 --> 00:50:43.503
So I was coaching there a bit.

1240
00:50:44.323 --> 00:50:45.184
Boys were getting serious,

1241
00:50:45.185 --> 00:50:46.464
so you want to watch them more.

1242
00:50:47.065 --> 00:50:47.825
So I'm watching them,

1243
00:50:48.265 --> 00:50:48.926
media work,

1244
00:50:50.326 --> 00:50:51.607
keeping myself busy in that sense.

1245
00:50:51.807 --> 00:50:53.208
And we need to talk about,

1246
00:50:54.721 --> 00:50:57.262
you're still playing football at this age as well.

1247
00:50:57.263 --> 00:50:58.903
We were speaking about it before the podcast,

1248
00:50:58.983 --> 00:51:00.272
but um

1249
00:51:00.800 --> 00:51:02.602
How's the body holding up playing in these games?

1250
00:51:03.562 --> 00:51:04.043
Joining the game,

1251
00:51:04.044 --> 00:51:04.603
not too bad.

1252
00:51:05.144 --> 00:51:05.844
The week after,

1253
00:51:06.225 --> 00:51:06.805
not so great.

1254
00:51:08.698 --> 00:51:08.999
But no,

1255
00:51:09.399 --> 00:51:11.000
it's just great to be out there at times.

1256
00:51:13.137 --> 00:51:14.679
I've joined up with Insure again,

1257
00:51:14.999 --> 00:51:15.439
signed up,

1258
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:15.640
so,

1259
00:51:16.640 --> 00:51:18.222
but I can choose when I want to.

1260
00:51:18.382 --> 00:51:18.642
Yeah.

1261
00:51:18.902 --> 00:51:19.443
When I play.

1262
00:51:20.704 --> 00:51:21.204
But yeah,

1263
00:51:21.805 --> 00:51:22.385
it's just great.

1264
00:51:22.645 --> 00:51:23.006
Sometimes,

1265
00:51:23.007 --> 00:51:23.186
you know,

1266
00:51:23.246 --> 00:51:25.748
it's great to be out there and just enjoy playing.

1267
00:51:26.873 --> 00:51:28.895
When you see the injury to Steve and then you're like,

1268
00:51:28.915 --> 00:51:29.675
oh,

1269
00:51:29.676 --> 00:51:30.256
is that football?

1270
00:51:30.688 --> 00:51:31.329
Is he still out?

1271
00:51:31.909 --> 00:51:32.329
He's still out,

1272
00:51:32.469 --> 00:51:32.650
yeah.

1273
00:51:33.250 --> 00:51:33.370
Yeah.

1274
00:51:33.371 --> 00:51:35.872
So I've seen that Stephen Ireland broke his leg or whatever it was,

1275
00:51:36.092 --> 00:51:36.853
a right bad one.

1276
00:51:38.422 --> 00:51:38.922
Tip and fib,

1277
00:51:38.923 --> 00:51:39.182
I think.

1278
00:51:39.183 --> 00:51:40.855
Jesus.

1279
00:51:40.856 --> 00:51:40.975
So,

1280
00:51:41.516 --> 00:51:41.736
yeah,

1281
00:51:41.816 --> 00:51:43.217
it was not great.

1282
00:51:43.477 --> 00:51:43.878
But yeah,

1283
00:51:43.978 --> 00:51:44.778
when you see that,

1284
00:51:44.818 --> 00:51:46.299
you're like second guessing it.

1285
00:51:46.339 --> 00:51:48.061
But when you get out there,

1286
00:51:48.062 --> 00:51:49.402
you just love playing that,

1287
00:51:49.442 --> 00:51:50.342
going out there and playing.

1288
00:51:50.403 --> 00:51:51.383
But you want a bit of fun.

1289
00:51:51.844 --> 00:51:52.064
Yeah.

1290
00:51:52.584 --> 00:51:53.905
I've done all the serious side of it.

1291
00:51:53.906 --> 00:51:55.186
I just want to enjoy myself.

1292
00:51:55.346 --> 00:51:57.880
Do you find playing at that level

1293
00:51:58.680 --> 00:51:59.740
People are still going,

1294
00:51:59.741 --> 00:52:00.501
I'm going to get him,

1295
00:52:00.521 --> 00:52:01.621
I'm going to give him one.

1296
00:52:01.981 --> 00:52:03.862
But that's part and parcel of it at times,

1297
00:52:03.863 --> 00:52:04.262
you know what I mean?

1298
00:52:04.263 --> 00:52:05.382
You've got to be sensible with it.

1299
00:52:05.402 --> 00:52:09.003
I'm not going in flying into tackles and saying I'm not 20 anymore.

1300
00:52:09.004 --> 00:52:11.244
So I've got to look after myself as well.

1301
00:52:11.664 --> 00:52:11.884
Yeah.

1302
00:52:12.184 --> 00:52:14.225
And see that team,

1303
00:52:14.226 --> 00:52:15.925
is it just full of ex-professionals now?

1304
00:52:15.926 --> 00:52:16.025
No,

1305
00:52:16.045 --> 00:52:16.405
no,

1306
00:52:16.426 --> 00:52:16.546
no.

1307
00:52:16.706 --> 00:52:17.286
At the start,

1308
00:52:17.766 --> 00:52:20.307
the starting line-up from the weekend's game,

1309
00:52:20.407 --> 00:52:22.747
I was telling you Bartley was at the back.

1310
00:52:22.748 --> 00:52:22.847
Yeah,

1311
00:52:22.848 --> 00:52:22.947
yeah,

1312
00:52:22.948 --> 00:52:23.448
yeah.

1313
00:52:23.449 --> 00:52:24.448
I'm looking through that team going...

1314
00:52:25.548 --> 00:52:25.728
Man,

1315
00:52:25.988 --> 00:52:28.730
that's a bit much George Boyd in the left wing and all that.

1316
00:52:28.750 --> 00:52:30.271
This is ridiculous.

1317
00:52:30.592 --> 00:52:30.972
But I'm like,

1318
00:52:31.252 --> 00:52:33.654
is there any random guys that are just off the street playing there?

1319
00:52:33.655 --> 00:52:34.054
Yeah,

1320
00:52:34.055 --> 00:52:34.174
yeah,

1321
00:52:34.175 --> 00:52:35.715
we've got some local lads.

1322
00:52:35.795 --> 00:52:35.995
Yeah.

1323
00:52:36.476 --> 00:52:41.867
You get some local lads but then you obviously get the lads who want to just come and enjoy a game of football.

1324
00:52:42.287 --> 00:52:42.528
Mine,

1325
00:52:42.529 --> 00:52:42.868
I figure,

1326
00:52:42.869 --> 00:52:45.870
I was injured at the minute so it would be him and Barkley at the back.

1327
00:52:46.250 --> 00:52:47.051
Yeah.

1328
00:52:47.052 --> 00:52:48.232
Is Valencia still playing?

1329
00:52:48.880 --> 00:52:49.740
He comes every now and again.

1330
00:52:49.741 --> 00:52:50.101
He lives in

1331
00:52:50.761 --> 00:52:51.521
Ecuador or wherever.

1332
00:52:51.642 --> 00:52:51.762
Oh,

1333
00:52:51.822 --> 00:52:53.823
does he just come over for the odd game when he's over?

1334
00:52:53.824 --> 00:52:53.923
Yeah,

1335
00:52:53.924 --> 00:52:54.564
when he comes over,

1336
00:52:54.584 --> 00:52:55.144
yeah.

1337
00:52:55.284 --> 00:52:56.245
But yeah,

1338
00:52:56.405 --> 00:52:57.706
who put that team together?

1339
00:52:57.766 --> 00:52:58.347
Was it Stephen Island?

1340
00:52:58.348 --> 00:52:58.767
It was Stephen.

1341
00:53:00.008 --> 00:53:00.989
So on,

1342
00:53:01.029 --> 00:53:01.269
I think,

1343
00:53:01.309 --> 00:53:02.070
Tuesdays,

1344
00:53:02.786 --> 00:53:05.028
we were playing seven-a-side anyway.

1345
00:53:05.148 --> 00:53:05.349
Yeah.

1346
00:53:05.729 --> 00:53:06.550
So we'd just get together,

1347
00:53:06.590 --> 00:53:07.390
play seven-a-side,

1348
00:53:07.410 --> 00:53:07.911
mess about,

1349
00:53:07.931 --> 00:53:08.311
blah,

1350
00:53:08.692 --> 00:53:09.432
give a bit of fitness.

1351
00:53:10.629 --> 00:53:11.190
And then it just,

1352
00:53:12.387 --> 00:53:12.747
I don't know,

1353
00:53:12.787 --> 00:53:13.488
excelled into that.

1354
00:53:13.568 --> 00:53:14.128
I don't know how.

1355
00:53:14.168 --> 00:53:16.450
You must know the owner of the club.

1356
00:53:17.115 --> 00:53:17.595
And they said,

1357
00:53:17.596 --> 00:53:17.875
oh yeah,

1358
00:53:18.195 --> 00:53:18.616
come and play.

1359
00:53:19.260 --> 00:53:19.801
Bring so-and-so.

1360
00:53:20.589 --> 00:53:21.130
Bring this player,

1361
00:53:21.150 --> 00:53:21.690
bring that player.

1362
00:53:21.870 --> 00:53:22.391
Yeah.

1363
00:53:22.392 --> 00:53:23.332
And then you just end up,

1364
00:53:23.472 --> 00:53:23.632
yeah.

1365
00:53:24.084 --> 00:53:25.325
Everyone just loves playing football,

1366
00:53:25.326 --> 00:53:28.107
so you end up with a full team of ex-players.

1367
00:53:30.389 --> 00:53:30.889
Drinkwater,

1368
00:53:31.409 --> 00:53:32.190
he can still play.

1369
00:53:32.822 --> 00:53:33.062
Yeah,

1370
00:53:33.623 --> 00:53:34.483
he can't be that old,

1371
00:53:34.484 --> 00:53:34.604
eh?

1372
00:53:34.605 --> 00:53:35.304
He's like,

1373
00:53:35.885 --> 00:53:37.566
he'll be 37,

1374
00:53:37.586 --> 00:53:39.019
38.

1375
00:53:39.079 --> 00:53:39.899
But he's like this.

1376
00:53:40.239 --> 00:53:40.600
Honestly,

1377
00:53:40.601 --> 00:53:42.041
he can get around the pitch and everything.

1378
00:53:42.141 --> 00:53:42.461
Brilliant.

1379
00:53:42.917 --> 00:53:44.058
Yeah.

1380
00:53:44.498 --> 00:53:47.276
Who's the top guy there just now in that team?

1381
00:53:47.296 --> 00:53:50.110
Probably him or Papacito.

1382
00:53:50.943 --> 00:53:51.823
Pap scores goals.

1383
00:53:52.023 --> 00:53:52.724
Scores goals there.

1384
00:53:52.948 --> 00:54:11.904
scoring goals every week I just see it all all the time on TikTok another one for him you're like jeez he could still probably play just looking at his building stuff but anyway we have had probably enough of your time so I don't want to hold you up for much longer but it has been an absolute pleasure to hear

1385
00:54:11.964 --> 00:54:19.587
some of your stuff and yeah hopefully you keep scoring goals maybe need to try and catch a game one day rather than watching it on TikTok

1386
00:54:21.929 --> 00:54:25.264
but I appreciate it thank you thank you thank you thank you always thank you